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Kohler K582 Head gaskets?

kohler k532 k582 head gasket

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#1 Mark 149 J. OFFLINE  

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Posted January 04, 2021 - 05:00 PM

Looking for suggestions for the best type of head gasket for my kohler k582 engine.  I usually go with kohler brand but I'm interested in what people have found that works good for them.  If you have a part number that would be great!


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#2 kjmweld ONLINE  

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Posted January 04, 2021 - 06:09 PM

I'm looking for them as well. Genuine Kohler gaskets are the best, but no longer have the original style with the metal "fire ring" unfortunately. Those are what I prefer, but they haven't been available for quite some time. I'm still holding out hope that I'll find some NOS gaskets as used originally, but worse come to worse I'll have to get what's available thru kohler now. Bolens 1000 (Brian) a site sponsor here carries them tho, if you want the new kohler gaskets.

Edited by kjmweld, January 04, 2021 - 06:10 PM.

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#3 EricFromPa OFFLINE  

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Posted January 04, 2021 - 06:22 PM

Check with ISaveTractors. His gasket sets have the good head gaskets with the fire ring. I'm pretty sure he has them made with the fire ring.

 

https://www.ebay.com...hgAAOSwMHtbmokw

 

Here are the head gaskets on his website.

https://isavetractor...2-k582-engines/


Edited by EricFromPa, January 04, 2021 - 06:26 PM.

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#4 29 Chev OFFLINE  

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Posted January 04, 2021 - 07:53 PM

Looking at Brian's website it appears that the new Kohler gaskets are a graphite version similar to what vehicle manufacturers switched over to back in the 1990's when engines were being replaced with cast iron block and aluminum head combinations rather than the conventional cast iron block and cylinder head combinations used for years and years by the big three. 

https://bolenspartsa...ns-wheel-horse/

 

Still remember seeing Chrysler 2.2 and 2.5 head gasket failures back around that time as aftermarket gasket manufacturers were learning the difference in expansion rates of aluminum versus cast iron and talking to the gasket sales / tech reps as to what was causing it and how they finally corrected the problem.  Back then the fire ring / composition style gasket was prevalent in automotive applications and the gaskets were actually gripping both the cast iron cylinder block on the bottom side and the aluminum cylinder head on the top side so well that the gasket was being pulled and stretched as the two components heated up and cooled down at different rates - eventually the gasket became the weak link and would sheared and fail.  When the head was removed after the failure you could actually see that some of the bolt and coolant holes had actually elongated from the original circular shape. The graphite material of the newer style gaskets allows the block and cylinder head to actually slide on the gasket face (yet still provide a good seal due to the head bolt clamping action) as each item heats up and cools down at their own rate. 

 

Some may find this an interesting read as it mentions that MLS (multi layer steel) gaskets are designed for very smooth surfaces 

https://www.felpro.c...ce-finish.html 

 

A lot of head gasket failures are caused by improper preparation before the new gasket is installed.  Failure to properly clean (and lubricate if required) the bolt holes and threads, check the block and head for trueness and cleanliness are just some of the things that can lead to premature head gasket failure.  Other things such as a lean fuel mixture, timing, wrong spark plug heat range, etc. can result in high combustion temperatures which can also result in gasket failure.   

 

Not saying that the fire rings style gaskets are not the way to go but I wouldn't be afraid to try the newer style graphite gaskets in an application where the head and block surface is not as smooth and true as it was when it left the factory.


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#5 Mark 149 J. OFFLINE  

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Posted January 04, 2021 - 08:47 PM

  

 

Not saying that the fire rings style gaskets are not the way to go but I wouldn't be afraid to try the newer style graphite gaskets in an application where the head and block surface is not as smooth and true as it was when it left the factory.

Thanks!

That was some very interesting information about head gasket materials.  I took off the heads tonight and the old gaskets look great.  Nothing was burnt or cracked so I think I will end up reusing them.  BTW the old gaskets have the fire ring.  

 

 

Check with ISaveTractors. His gasket sets have the good head gaskets with the fire ring. I'm pretty sure he has them made with the fire ring.

 

https://www.ebay.com...hgAAOSwMHtbmokw

 

Here are the head gaskets on his website.

https://isavetractor...2-k582-engines/

Thanks!

I've bought several parts from that place with no problems.  I'm might still buy them from him.

 

 

I'm looking for them as well. Genuine Kohler gaskets are the best, but no longer have the original style with the metal "fire ring" unfortunately. Those are what I prefer, but they haven't been available for quite some time. I'm still holding out hope that I'll find some NOS gaskets as used originally, but worse come to worse I'll have to get what's available thru kohler now. Bolens 1000 (Brian) a site sponsor here carries them tho, if you want the new kohler gaskets.

Thanks!

I will keep Bolens 1000 on my list for parts.


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#6 Mark 149 J. OFFLINE  

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Posted January 04, 2021 - 08:48 PM

Eric, have you see a difference between the newer vs old style head gaskets with all the small engine work you've done?

The other problem I have is 3 of the 4 valves on the engine are burnt.  What have you done in cases like this?  Did you have to have the seat ground?



#7 EricFromPa OFFLINE  

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Posted January 05, 2021 - 12:20 AM

Haven't had the pleasure of working on a K582 with the exception of carb cleaning/rebuilding, points, condenser and a couple coils. I did put rings and new con rods in a couple of M18s but that's all I've done with any opposed twin cylinder Kohler.

 

I've cut in more than a few Onan and opposed twin Briggs and single cylinder briggs and Kohler valve seats and lapped in alot of valves though. I have an old valve seat cutter set with replaceable carbide cutters. It's in a wood box with leather strap hinges. I have no idea who made it or how old it is but it works pretty darn good.

 

I hate doing valve guides so I let my uncle do them for me. He seems to enjoy doing them more than I do.  :rolling:  I don't have a valve guide reamer set yet and it's easier to cut them out on the bridgeport freeze them and drop them in and ream them with the block bolted or clamped to the table on the mill. 

 

If the valve isn't really bad as in missing pieces I've chucked them up in a drill and used my bench grinder before and it works pretty decent in a pinch if you have a steady hand. But it takes a good bit of lapping even with a fine stone on the grinder. My uncle has a newer lathe and alot of tooling so I let him turn valves for me. It's alot faster, leaves a better finish and it takes the guess work out of cutting a perfect 45* angle. 

 

Now if I could only talk him into getting a bigger boring bar for his bridgeport he could bore engines for me.lol 

 

Those newer soft graphite head gaskets don't blow out as fast as the laminated steel ones that do not have the fire ring. I've had Alot of those fail. They like to burn out between the layers. 

 

Here this is a graphite head gasket for a K11/K181. Only bad thing about them is that they can not be reused. If you take the head back off for any reason the gasket will be ruined. They seem to hold up better than the laminated ones that do not have the fire ring.

head gasket.jpeg


Edited by EricFromPa, January 05, 2021 - 12:30 AM.

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#8 Mark 149 J. OFFLINE  

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Posted January 05, 2021 - 01:04 AM

Sounds like to have a lot of good resources when working on these types of engines.

 

This K582 is in my Toro GMT 200.  I have another post for it here on GTTalk.  You can see pictures of how bad the valves are.  Take a look.


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#9 29 Chev OFFLINE  

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Posted January 05, 2021 - 10:36 AM

Thanks!

That was some very interesting information about head gasket materials.  I took off the heads tonight and the old gaskets look great.  Nothing was burnt or cracked so I think I will end up reusing them.  

 

 

 

 

 

 

The Kohler Service Manual recommends new gaskets on reassembly - up to you.  In my world putting on used head gaskets that have already been compressed is like reusing a brake flex hose copper gasket - odds are you will get away with it but every once in a while it will come back to haunt you with a leak. 

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#10 fredh OFFLINE  

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Posted January 05, 2021 - 12:38 PM

I have been putting a light coating of never seize on my head gaskets for years. It has always seemed to work well as far as sealing and in taking back apart when need be. Also, I always put never seize on the head bolt threads because that is the only way to get reliable torque results. Almost always use never seize on engine parts like carb. gaskets, intake and exhaust gaskets and bolts and any place that may want to heat up and stick together. Hope this helps. Fred.


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