Jump to content

Nominations for Tractor of the Month
Garden Tractors and Parts on eBay



Photo
- - - - -

Looking for advice or information on building hydraulic lift systems


  • Please log in to reply
36 replies to this topic

#31 KennyP ONLINE  

KennyP

    FORDoholic

  • Super Moderator
  • Staff
  • -GTt Supporter-
  • Contributor
  • Member No: 2253
  • 28,419 Thanks
  • 39,669 posts
  • Location: Collinsville, Oklahoma

Posted November 13, 2011 - 05:30 PM

Return line has a bolt off to the side on a flat plate sort of thing, tube seals with an o-ring in the hole. Haven't been able to find a pic of one as yet.

#32 KennyP ONLINE  

KennyP

    FORDoholic

  • Super Moderator
  • Staff
  • -GTt Supporter-
  • Contributor
  • Member No: 2253
  • 28,419 Thanks
  • 39,669 posts
  • Location: Collinsville, Oklahoma

Posted November 13, 2011 - 05:31 PM

Sounds like you're planning a hydraulic dump actuator for your dump trailer? That will be slick.---LeeB:D

Nope, this may go on the GTV/16 for hyd. there.

#33 TUDOR OFFLINE  

TUDOR

    Tractorholic

  • Senior Member
  • Member No: 915
  • 543 Thanks
  • 497 posts
  • Location: Sault Ste Marie, Ontario

Posted November 20, 2011 - 06:58 AM

For your reading pleasure.

Principles of Hydraulics

Hydraulic Tutorials

GM power steering pumps make great small displacement hydraulic systems if used with a remote reservoir. As installed in cars and light trucks, they are flow controlled at approximately 2 gpm and pressure relieved at 1250-1450 psi. A 2" bore cylinder will push 3926 lb @ 147"/minute and, with a 1" dia. rod, will pull 2945 lb @ 196"/minute, @1250 psi and 2 gpm. This is just to give you an idea of what to look for in your calculations. One gallon is 231 cubic inches. The pump will flow quite a bit more with modifications, but I've never tried. Check with the rock crawlers for that info. They use modified GM p/s pumps for their suspension systems, from what I've heard.

A flow rate under 6 gpm can be accomodated with 1/4" hose , but that's the upper limit. Here's a nomograph flow chart link from Gates.

http://www.gates.com...ocation_id=3047

At one time I had a Vickers bent axis piston pump like that for my FEL. Great little pump that would move about 6 gpm, if I recall correctly. Took it apart one too many times and didn't get it back together right. OOPS! *%#@@^$$!!!!

Heat is a killer for hydraulics. Normal operating temperature is 140* - 160*F, 190* is barely acceptable and over 200* is baaad. A long skinny reservoir will dump heat faster than a short fat reservoir and the reservoir should contain 1/4 to 1 times the flow rate of the pump for mobile systems. Leave at least 10% room for expansion. A filter is always a good idea.
  • KennyP and Michiganmobileman have said thanks

#34 skyrydr2 OFFLINE  

skyrydr2

    Tractorholic

  • Senior Member
  • -GTt Supporter-
  • Contributor
  • Member No: 5032
  • 3,408 Thanks
  • 3,158 posts
  • Location: Gardner, Massachusetts!

Posted November 20, 2011 - 07:34 AM

Since we're on the subject, I have a power steering pump off an Intrepid (rebuilt, in the box). Anybody have an idea of finding a v-belt pulley to fit it? Shaft is about .715", or 18 mm. I would have to find a return line fitting for it. Probably from a you-pull auto parts place.

FOUND IT! Dorman ProductsPowerSteeringPulleys
[ATTACH=CONFIG]24750[/ATTACH]
This is what is supposed to be on it. I found this one for a v-belt:
[ATTACH=CONFIG]24752[/ATTACH]
.002 bigger ID. Should work okay, you think?


Kenny , you will need to get the correct shaft size on the pulley as it is pressed on with a special tool ,and removed with another, the pump you have is perfect for applications of any sort for a GT. If putting it on the Ford mount it on the driveshaft side of the engine as if it were going on the car's engine as it must turn clockwise.
You will need a smaller pulley on the pump or a very large one to drive it off the engine. the pump needs to have decent rpm to get the vains working. This is a good thing especially for cold starts ,as the pump doesnt pump at first , letting the engine get going.
these pumps are also very easily modified to pump up to 8 gpm with very little effort, and if you want to play around with springs you can even get them to pump as high as 3000 psi. bit I do not recomend this , as most gt apps are made to handle 2500 psi tops . It stresses seals and hoses too. so the stock 1200-1600 psi should be just fine.

If you need a pulley made up you know how to get a hold of me :thumbs:
  • KennyP and Michiganmobileman have said thanks

#35 KennyP ONLINE  

KennyP

    FORDoholic

  • Super Moderator
  • Staff
  • -GTt Supporter-
  • Contributor
  • Member No: 2253
  • 28,419 Thanks
  • 39,669 posts
  • Location: Collinsville, Oklahoma

Posted November 20, 2011 - 08:11 AM

Tudor, thanks for the links, some good reading in there. I might learn something!:bounce:
Keith, you have mail!

#36 TUDOR OFFLINE  

TUDOR

    Tractorholic

  • Senior Member
  • Member No: 915
  • 543 Thanks
  • 497 posts
  • Location: Sault Ste Marie, Ontario

Posted November 20, 2011 - 03:35 PM

Now, I'm NOT suggesting anything, however,if it were mine, I'd put on some old clothes, connect the tank to the suction side of the pump, then plumb a high pressure gauge* DIRECTLY into the discharge port, using NO hose, then rig up some sort of momentary switch in order to just bump the motor, perhaps less than 1 full RPM. Then I stand far enough away that I could see the gauge when it fires and that would tell me whether the pump was good or not and how much pressure I had to play with.

I've done it many times. Its called deadheading the pump. I've had a few nasty baths and so that's why I don't recommend this to anyone.:blush2:

*5000psi


It's also a good way to destroy a pump. Pumps have pressure ratings because of the strength of the various parts. Without a relief valve to bleed off excessive pressure, the housing or some other part downstream from the actual pumping elements can be fractured, sometimes with painful results for any persons in close proximity.

Deadheading a pump comes under the heading of "A BAD IDEA"!!! Especially when dealing with prime movers that have a lot more horsepower than the pump can deal with.

#37 Michiganmobileman OFFLINE  

Michiganmobileman

    Old Tractor Addict

  • Senior Member
  • -GTt Supporter-
  • Contributor
  • Member No: 5678
  • 1,235 Thanks
  • 1,842 posts
  • Location: Barryton, Michigan

Posted November 20, 2011 - 07:45 PM

For your reading pleasure.

Principles of Hydraulics

Hydraulic Tutorials

GM power steering pumps make great small displacement hydraulic systems if used with a remote reservoir. As installed in cars and light trucks, they are flow controlled at approximately 2 gpm and pressure relieved at 1250-1450 psi. A 2" bore cylinder will push 3926 lb @ 147"/minute and, with a 1" dia. rod, will pull 2945 lb @ 196"/minute, @1250 psi and 2 gpm. This is just to give you an idea of what to look for in your calculations. One gallon is 231 cubic inches. The pump will flow quite a bit more with modifications, but I've never tried. Check with the rock crawlers for that info. They use modified GM p/s pumps for their suspension systems, from what I've heard.

A flow rate under 6 gpm can be accomodated with 1/4" hose , but that's the upper limit. Here's a nomograph flow chart link from Gates.

http://www.gates.com...ocation_id=3047

At one time I had a Vickers bent axis piston pump like that for my FEL. Great little pump that would move about 6 gpm, if I recall correctly. Took it apart one too many times and didn't get it back together right. OOPS! *%#@@^$$!!!!

Heat is a killer for hydraulics. Normal operating temperature is 140* - 160*F, 190* is barely acceptable and over 200* is baaad. A long skinny reservoir will dump heat faster than a short fat reservoir and the reservoir should contain 1/4 to 1 times the flow rate of the pump for mobile systems. Leave at least 10% room for expansion. A filter is always a good idea.


WOW Lots of good stuff in those links and included info, kind of what I was looking for:smile1: :thumbs::worshippy2:

Kenny , you will need to get the correct shaft size on the pulley as it is pressed on with a special tool ,and removed with another, the pump you have is perfect for applications of any sort for a GT. If putting it on the Ford mount it on the driveshaft side of the engine as if it were going on the car's engine as it must turn clockwise.
You will need a smaller pulley on the pump or a very large one to drive it off the engine. the pump needs to have decent rpm to get the vains working. This is a good thing especially for cold starts ,as the pump doesnt pump at first , letting the engine get going.
these pumps are also very easily modified to pump up to 8 gpm with very little effort, and if you want to play around with springs you can even get them to pump as high as 3000 psi. bit I do not recomend this , as most gt apps are made to handle 2500 psi tops . It stresses seals and hoses too. so the stock 1200-1600 psi should be just fine.

If you need a pulley made up you know how to get a hold of me :thumbs:


Again some real valuable input and info,
Thanks to all :thumbs::thumbs::thumbs::thumbs:




Top