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Tube Frame Gear Drive Hydraulic Lift Build With Generic Pump, Valve And Cylinder


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#76 29 Chev ONLINE  

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Posted March 06, 2018 - 05:17 PM

Was thinking of the 12v hydraulics systems that are available here in the uk, included with a ram for £300. Don’t think it would be too bad for my custom bolens, possibly a linkbox?

 

I have thought about using one of those but one of my concerns is they take up a bit of room - not sure it would be any less expensive than what I am doing.  The other thing is they would require a good battery and perhaps a better charging system than what the starter generator would put out on my 1053 if you were using it constantly such as doing multiple passes blowing snow or lifting a blade.  They require a good heavy battery cable run to the electric motor to provide the proper voltage and amperage as the electric motors can draw almost as much current as a starter motor.  You would still have to fabricate a bracket to mount it, figure out a control valve and plumb the hydraulic hoses to a lift cylinder.   
 


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#77 Sammoore13bolens1053 ONLINE  

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Posted March 07, 2018 - 04:25 AM

I have thought about using one of those but one of my concerns is they take up a bit of room - not sure it would be any less expensive than what I am doing.  The other thing is they would require a good battery and perhaps a better charging system than what the starter generator would put out on my 1053 if you were using it constantly such as doing multiple passes blowing snow or lifting a blade.  They require a good heavy battery cable run to the electric motor to provide the proper voltage and amperage as the electric motors can draw almost as much current as a starter motor.  You would still have to fabricate a bracket to mount it, figure out a control valve and plumb the hydraulic hoses to a lift cylinder.


Yes, my 2cv engine, I believe would have enough power to start the hydraulics all up

#78 Sammoore13bolens1053 ONLINE  

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Posted March 07, 2018 - 04:46 AM

I have thought about using one of those but one of my concerns is they take up a bit of room - not sure it would be any less expensive than what I am doing.  The other thing is they would require a good battery and perhaps a better charging system than what the starter generator would put out on my 1053 if you were using it constantly such as doing multiple passes blowing snow or lifting a blade.  They require a good heavy battery cable run to the electric motor to provide the proper voltage and amperage as the electric motors can draw almost as much current as a starter motor.  You would still have to fabricate a bracket to mount it, figure out a control valve and plumb the hydraulic hoses to a lift cylinder.

A
Also, the one I’m looking at has a 12v and everything included, even the ram, hoses and a up and down switch

#79 29 Chev ONLINE  

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Posted March 07, 2018 - 05:56 PM

Threaded the hole for the cylinder bolt with a 1/2" UNC tap and bolted the cylinder bracket on to the transmission cover.  Found out I had three bolt holes properly aligned and the left front hole was off by 1/16" so I used the die grinder with the carbide burr to remove a bit of material so the fourth bolt would thread in ok.  Found a 1/2" bolt that was lots long so I mounted the cylinder and threaded the bolt in - looks like I should have room between the bracket and the frame tube for a couple of 1/2" nuts so I will probably weld one to the inside of the bracket and the second nut will be used as a lam nut to lock the bolt in place.  Verified the cylinder was short enough to mount behind the lift bracket and checked out the space between the cylinder and the frame tube and I am hoping that there will be enough room to leave the fittings on the cylinder underneath and bring the cylinder hoses up between the cylinder and the frame tube.  Things looked good so I removed the manual lift lever from the lift arm. 

Attached Thumbnails

  • 1 Hole Threaded Half Inch UNC.jpg
  • 2 Cylinder Bracket Bolted In Place.jpg
  • 3 Cylinder Bracket Bolted In Place.jpg
  • 4 Bolt Hole Ahead Of Transmission Bracket.jpg
  • 5 Cylinder Bolted On To Bracket.jpg
  • 6 Cylinder Short Enough To Fit Behind Lift Arm.jpg
  • 7 Space Between Cylinder And Frame Tube.jpg
  • 8 Starting To Remove Lift Lever.jpg
  • 9 Lift Lever Removed.jpg

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#80 29 Chev ONLINE  

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Posted March 07, 2018 - 06:14 PM

Once the lift lever was removed I cut a piece of 1/4" x 1-1/4" flat steel and drilled two 3/8" holes so it could be bolted to the lift arm and extend about 3/4" behind the lift arm.  Bolted it on to the lift arm and then verified that the cylinder was pretty well centred in relation to the lift arm.  Did some thinking about how to attach the front of the cylinder to the metal link I had made - decided to weld up a U bracket out of three pieces of 1-1/4" x 1/4" flat steel with two 1/2" holes for a front pin.  I tack welded a piece of 1/8" x 1" flat steel to the bottom of the U bracket so I could clamp it to the link with a pair of vise grips and see how the arm travel looked with the cylinder retracted and extended - with it clamped I could adjust the U bracket up or down and roll it a little bit if necessary so that the lift arm would be in the correct position when the cylinder was fully retracted or fully extended.  Since the lift arm moves through an offset arc (in relation to cylinder and this cylinder has more travel than an original cylinder) as the cylinder extends it was not a simple matter of getting the lift arm in the correct position with the cylinder retracted - there is probably a mathematical way to calculate the required  pin position but I figured this method was simpler for me.  I bolted the link back on to the lift arm and clamped the U bracket on to it with a pair of vise grips.

Attached Thumbnails

  • 1 Inch And A Quarter X Quater Inch Piece Bolted On To Lift Arm.jpg
  • 2 Checking Alignment Of Cylinder With Lift Arm.jpg
  • 3 Deciding How To Attach End Of Cylinder.jpg
  • 4 U Bracket To Mount Cylinder.jpg
  • 5 Piece Of Steel Tacked To Bottom Of U Bracket.jpg
  • 6 Piece Of Steel Only Tacked On One Side.jpg
  • 7 U Bracket Clamped On With Vise Grips.jpg
  • 8 U Bracket Clamped On With Vise Grips.jpg
  • 9 U Bracket Clamped On With Vise Grips.jpg

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#81 29 Chev ONLINE  

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Posted March 07, 2018 - 07:12 PM

I used the cylinder to check how the retracted (10-1/4") length looked and I use a pieced of 1/8" X 1" flat steel with two 1/2" holes to check how the extended (16-1/4") length looked.  That way I could just slip a 1/2" bolt into the cylinder eye and the hole in the flat steel to check on the arm movement.  Initially I set the U bracket flat on the link and with the retracted length set the arm in the correct position - then I checked the extended length with the flat steel and it was very close but needed about another 3/16" of movement fro the arm to be in the correct position.  Initially I tried just moving the U bracket  up about 1/4" and clamped it again and checked the arm alignment but still could not get the arm quite where I wanted it to be when in the lowered position so I rolled the U bracket a little bit in relation to the link and that seemed to do the trick to get the full lift arm movement.  It didn't take much of a roll but once I had it where things looked good I removed the link with the bracket still clamped to it and took a couple of close up pictures.   

Attached Thumbnails

  • 1 One Inch Flat Steel With Holes Drilled To Simultate Extended Cylinder.jpg
  • 2 Lift Arm Not Quite Ahead Far Enough.jpg
  • 3 Cylinder Retracted Alignment.jpg
  • 4 Cylinder Retracted Alignment.jpg
  • 5 U Bracket Sitting Flat On Bolt On Link.jpg
  • 6 U bracket Tilted A Little Bit.jpg
  • 7 U bracket Tilted A Little Bit.jpg
  • 8 Extended Position.jpg
  • 9 Cylinder Retracted.jpg
  • 10 Bracket Removed To Tack Weld.jpg
  • 11 Bracket Removed To Tack Weld.jpg

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#82 29 Chev ONLINE  

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Posted March 07, 2018 - 07:17 PM

Then I did a heavy tack weld on the one side of the U bracket to the link and removed the vise grips.  Once it had cooled I bolted the link back on and double checked the extended and retracted position of the arm to make sure nothing had moved.  I also had a good look and verified that the head of a 1/2" bolt would clear the rear bolt that holds the battery tray - things looked good so I think I have the cylinder position pretty well figured out.  Once I get the pump and control valve hooked up I will cycle the cylinder to verify that everything works as it should and if it does I will finish welding the U bracket to the link.  Will have to mount the pump bracket with the pump and valve on now and see what length of hoses I will need to plumb things up.

Attached Thumbnails

  • 1 Bracket Tack Welded.jpg
  • 2 Bracket Tack Welded.jpg
  • 3 Left Tab For Now.jpg
  • 4 Bracket Remounted Checking Extended Position.jpg
  • 5 Cylinder Retracted.jpg
  • 6 Top View.jpg
  • 7 Verifying Clearance With Battery Tray Screw.jpg
  • 8 Bolted Inserted With Head In.jpg
  • 9 U Goes Under Battery Tray Bolt.jpg
  • 10 Head Clears Battery Tray Bolt.jpg
  • 11 Head Clears Battery Tray Bolt.jpg

Edited by 29 Chev, March 07, 2018 - 08:00 PM.

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#83 logmillingman ONLINE  

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Posted March 07, 2018 - 10:00 PM

Stew a lot of work figuring everything out, its coming together nice,

 

Keep up the good work, looks like your 90+% complete :thumbs:


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#84 29 Chev ONLINE  

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Posted March 08, 2018 - 04:48 PM

There are many little things to factor in to make sure that the cylinder movement will function and clear - a bit of head scratching at times.

 

Got the new bars installed under the motor, installed the bracket, pump tank, valve and figured out how I would route the hoses with the help of a piece of 3/8" I.D. fuel hose to simulate the bends the hydraulic hoses will have to make.  I figured out a length for the four hoses and will have to see how they fit when I go to install them - getting them made locally and they should be ready next week.  Ran into a slight problem when I went to install the two fittings that hook to the cylinder hoses on the control valve.  I had planned on using two 90° degree fittings but here was not enough room to turn the second one once the first one was threaded in so I will use a straight fitting and a 90° pipe elbow to accomplish the bend.  I am hoping to have the front hose that connects to the cylinder curl backwards and then come up beside the cylinder next to the rear cylinder hose but not sure if there will be enough movement with fittings on the end of the hose as the hydraulic hose will be stiffer than the fuel line.  May have to use a couple of 45° or 90° elbows at the cylinder fittings to accomplish this - will see what happens.

Attached Thumbnails

  • 1 New Bars Under Engine.jpg
  • 2 New Bars Under Engine.jpg
  • 3 Pump Bracket Mounted.jpg
  • 4 Pump Bracket Mounted.jpg
  • 5 Pump Mounted.jpg
  • 6 Pump Mounted.jpg
  • 7 Tank Mounted.jpg
  • 8 Tank Mounted.jpg
  • 9 Tank Mounted.jpg
  • 10 Cylinder Fittings.jpg
  • 11 Cylinder Fittings.jpg
  • 12 Fittings In Top Of Control  Valve.jpg
  • 13 Not Enough Room To Turn Second Ninety Degree Fitting.jpg
  • 14 Piece Of Three Eigths Inch Fuel Hose To Figure Out Length.jpg

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#85 29 Chev ONLINE  

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Posted March 09, 2018 - 02:56 PM

Got a 1/2" UNC nut welded on the inside of the bracket that mounts on top of the transmission and also cut and welded a piece of 16 gauge steel over the opening in the bracket - this should keep any debris that might have sat in the well that the bracket made from accumulating on the transmission cover.  Once things had cooled I noticed that the welding had curved the 1/4" flat steel a little bit side to side so I straightened it with a couple of love taps from the hammer.  Then I chased the threaded hole and nut with a 1/2" UNC tap to make sure the threads were clean.  I also used the sander to round the edges of the bracket that bolts to the lift arm and then I gave the transmission bracket a quick splash of paint. 

Attached Thumbnails

  • 1 Half Inch Nut Wedled On Inside Of Threaded Hole.jpg
  • 2 Half Inch Nut Wedled On Inside Of Threaded Hole.jpg
  • 3 16 Gauge Piece Welded Over Opening.jpg
  • 4 16 Gauge Piece Welded Over Opening.jpg
  • 5 16 Gauge Piece Welded Over Opening.jpg
  • 6 Corners Rounded On Bracket For Lift Arm.jpg
  • 7 Corners Rounded On Bracket For Lift Arm.jpg
  • 8 Corners Rounded On Bracket For Lift Arm.jpg
  • 9 Transmission Bracket Got A Splash Of Paint.jpg

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Posted March 12, 2018 - 04:35 PM

Bolted the painted transmission bracket back on and reinstalled the lift cylinder and lift arm link.  Picked up the hydraulic hoses and did a test fit of the two shorter hoses that run from the pump and tank to the valve.  The return hose fit fine and with the help of a 45° angle fitting the pressure hose will work as well.  I tried to install the pressure hose with out the angle fitting but there is just not enough flex in the hose to make it work without putting undue strain on the hose and fittings.  Another option would be to use two pipe to inverted flare fittings and a piece of steel brake line bent to fit which I may do yet if I have to restrict the oil flow to slow the cylinder action down.  I had originally planned on using the 45° fitting on the cylinder fittings but I am not sure I will need to - time will tell.  I have listed the lengths of the hose that I went with but if you are planning on making a lift you may want to verify the lengths as the way I intended on routing the hoses, while it would work, is not what I will go with in the end as you will see in the next couple of posts.

Attached Thumbnails

  • 1 Transmission Bracket Installed.jpg
  • 2 Transmission Bracket Installed.jpg
  • 3 New Hoses.jpg
  • 4 Pressure And Return Hoses From Pump To Valve.jpg
  • 5 Hose Lengths.jpg
  • 6 Test Fit Of Hoses.jpg
  • 7 Pump To Valve Pressure Hose.jpg
  • 8 Pump To Valve Pressure Hose.jpg
  • 9 Return Hose.jpg
  • 10 Hoses Clear Muffler.jpg
  • 11 Hoses Clear Muffler.jpg

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#87 29 Chev ONLINE  

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Posted March 12, 2018 - 04:45 PM

Next I test fitted the two longer hoses which go to the cylinder.  I used two 45° fittings at the cylinder end to start the hoses upward between the cylinder and the frame tube as I had planned on and while things looked like they might work the front hose was looking like it would be close to the fender when the fender was put back on and the hose also was close to the hi lo range lever which could make shifting ranges difficult in the winter time with gloves on the hands.  Things looked not to bad at the valve end where the hoses would connect to the valve - I have a straight fitting for the one valve connection still on order.  The last picture shows how the pressure hose to the valve aligns without the 45° fitting - not much rubber between the two hose ends to gain enough flex to get the fittings to thread together.

Attached Thumbnails

  • 1 Cylinder Hoses Test Fit.jpg
  • 2 Cylinder Hoses Test Fit.jpg
  • 3  Cylinder Hoses Test Fit 45 Degree Fittings.jpg
  • 4 Cylinder Hoses Test Fit 45 Degree Fittings.jpg
  • 5 Cylinder Hoses Test Fit 45 Degree Fittings.jpg
  • 6 Cylinder Hoses Test Fit Valve End.jpg
  • 7 Cylinder Hoses Test Fit Valve End.jpg
  • 8 Not Enough Flex For Hose To Go On To Valve Fitting.jpg

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#88 Sammoore13bolens1053 ONLINE  

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Posted March 12, 2018 - 04:53 PM

Next I test fitted the two longer hoses which go to the cylinder.  I used two 45° fittings at the cylinder end to start the hoses upward between the cylinder and the frame tube as I had planned on and while things looked like they might work the front hose was looking like it would be close to the fender when the fender was put back on and the hose also was close to the hi lo range lever which could make shifting ranges difficult in the winter time with gloves on the hands.  Things looked not to bad at the valve end where the hoses would connect to the valve - I have a straight fitting for the one valve connection still on order.  The last picture shows how the pressure hose to the valve aligns without the 45° fitting - not much rubber between the two hose ends to gain enough flex to get the fittings to thread together.


Looking good now, will the Wisconsin beagle to handle everything happening at once?

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Posted March 12, 2018 - 05:03 PM

Did some more thinking and routing of the cylinder hoses and reached the conclusion that this might be a better routing - the longer hose is now connected straight to the rear cylinder fitting and the shorter one will connect to the front cylinder fitting with a 90° elbow that I will have to order.  This routing is the one that I think will work better and keep the hoses from rubbing on the side of the dash support - may have to make a bracket where the original lift lever would have bolted on to the side of the dash support to keep the hoses spaced out a little bit - time will tell.  This routing definitely gets the hoses away from the fender area and the hi lo lever which I like - will see how things work when I get the hoses hooked up once I get the other fittings I need and the cylinder rises and falls a little bit at the front as it moves the lift arm away from it.  Since I am using 1/4" NPTM on the hose ends and ORB to 1/4" NPTF it is interesting to note that in most hydraulic applications the pipe thread is not where the seal is but rather on a 30° seat that is machined into the fittings.  As a result I decided to machine a 30° seat surface into one of the brass barbed hose fitting that attaches to the intake fitting of the pump since there was no seat in it.  The brass was smooth and it probably would have seated ok since this is a suction fitting but I did not want to chance it so I chucked the fitting in the lathe and quickly machined a seat. The last three pictures show the brass fittings (one with the new seat machined) and the seats on the female end and the male hose end.  

Attached Thumbnails

  • 1 Second Cylinder Routing Test.jpg
  • 2 Second Cylinder Routing Test.jpg
  • 3 Second Cylinder Routing Test.jpg
  • 4 Second Cylinder Routing Test.jpg
  • 5 Second Cylinder Routing Test.jpg
  • 6 Second Cylinder Routing Test.jpg
  • 7 Second Cylinder Routing Test.jpg
  • 8 Right Fitting WIth 30 Degree Seat Machined For Pump Intake Fitting.jpg
  • 9 Seat In Pump Intake Fitting.jpg
  • 10 Seat On Hose Fittings.jpg

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#90 29 Chev ONLINE  

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Posted March 12, 2018 - 05:08 PM

Then I cut a couple of steps off of the two brass barbs so I won't have to fight with them as bad installing a piece of rubber hose and did some painting.  Gave the pulley, valve, valve bracket and the two braces a splash of paint.  I put some thread sealer on the barb fitting without the seat and threaded it into the fitting on the tank - this fitting seals on the threads and is low pressure (suction) to the pump. 

Attached Thumbnails

  • 1 Barb Steps Cut.jpg
  • 2 Pulley Painted.jpg
  • 3 Valve Painted.jpg
  • 4 Valve Bracket Painted.jpg
  • 5 Bracket Brace Painted.jpg
  • 6 Bracket Brace Painted.jpg
  • 7 Intake Fitting Threaded Into Tank.jpg

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