Jump to content

Garden Tractors and Parts on eBay



Photo
- - - - -

First time - Valve seat reamer


  • Please log in to reply
25 replies to this topic

#1 bbuckler ONLINE  

bbuckler
  • Senior Member
  • Member No: 59269
  • 2,855 Thanks
  • 2,535 posts
  • Location: Killeen,Tx

Posted March 10, 2017 - 04:08 PM

I hope I did this right the seat reamer i used said to use 45° and then 15° and a finishing 45°

Attached Thumbnails

  • 17201320_1383260008397666_3520417370511453819_n.jpg

  • Mark 149 J. said thank you

#2 boyscout862 ONLINE  

boyscout862
  • Senior Member
  • Member No: 8923
  • 11,482 Thanks
  • 8,484 posts
  • Location: N.E. Connecticut

Posted March 10, 2017 - 04:48 PM

Did you follow the manual? If so you are probably okay. The final test is the lapping. It will tell you how you are doing. After grinding only use the fine lapping compound. Good Luck, Rick
  • bbuckler said thank you

#3 DougT OFFLINE  

DougT

    Dog Approved

  • Super Moderator
  • Staff
  • -GTt Supporter-
  • Contributor
  • Member No: 584
  • 6,571 Thanks
  • 4,743 posts
  • Location: north central Ohio

Posted March 10, 2017 - 05:43 PM

Like Rick says, the final lap will tell the story. When you lap the valve you want the pattern to be somewhat centered on the valve. The 15* and 60* will help you accomplish that. Never remove more from the seat than what it takes to clean it up and make it round.


  • boyscout862 and bbuckler have said thanks

#4 Bruce Dorsi ONLINE  

Bruce Dorsi

    Old, but not dead -- yet!

  • Senior Member
  • -GTt Supporter-
  • Contributor
  • Member No: 1525
  • 3,823 Thanks
  • 2,415 posts
  • Location: New Jersey

Posted March 10, 2017 - 05:44 PM

An easy way to check your work is to paint the valve seat with a magic marker.

 

After lapping the valve, you should see a nice, even, gray band where the ink was removed. 

 

A narrow (1/16") seat is acceptable for an intake valve, but the exhaust valve should have a wider contact area (approx. 3/32"-1/8").

 

The wider seat on the exhaust valve helps remove heat from the exhaust valve while it is closed.  ...The intake valve gets cooled by the incoming air/fuel mixture, so it does not rely on the seat as much to dissipate heat.


  • lyall, boyscout862, bbuckler and 1 other said thanks

#5 bbuckler ONLINE  

bbuckler
  • Senior Member
  • Member No: 59269
  • 2,855 Thanks
  • 2,535 posts
  • Location: Killeen,Tx

Posted March 11, 2017 - 03:11 PM

An easy way to check your work is to paint the valve seat with a magic marker.

 

After lapping the valve, you should see a nice, even, gray band where the ink was removed. 

 

A narrow (1/16") seat is acceptable for an intake valve, but the exhaust valve should have a wider contact area (approx. 3/32"-1/8").

 

The wider seat on the exhaust valve helps remove heat from the exhaust valve while it is closed.  ...The intake valve gets cooled by the incoming air/fuel mixture, so it does not rely on the seat as much to dissipate heat.

Don't know if it the lighting in the barn but it looks like it wore the marker completely off.



#6 secondtry ONLINE  

secondtry
  • Senior Member
  • Member No: 83632
  • 1,134 Thanks
  • 933 posts
  • Location: Washington State

Posted March 11, 2017 - 04:46 PM

   I have followed this thread and am not sure I understand. In your original post you say the reamer you used says to use 45 then 15 then finish 45. I am not sure what this means or how you interpreted it. Since you did not mention the brand or size of the engine you are working on we can't go to the manuals section and try to find the manufacturer's recommended valve and seat geometry. If the valve has to little contact with the seat it will leak and or over heat and burn prematurely. If the valve has to much contact with the seat it is also likely to leak and burn prematurely. My eyes have gotten old it is now necessary for me to use many different aids to inspect such things. I never go any place without reading glasses and my AA size led flash light. I have even gone so far  as to buy a USB microscope that I can plug into the lap top and bring the picture up on the screen magnified many hundreds of times. Brand name on mine says SupperEyes, $19.00 delivered if I remember right. Engine ID and more pictures would help. I would clean every thing thoroughly, coat the the seat with magic marker, put the valve in clean and turn it some then see what the marker looked like. In your original picture I'm guessing intake valve, I can only see one angle cut in the seat, if that angle is the same as the angle of the valve grind it will have full contact across the seat grind and that is probably not what the manufacturer recommends. Don      



#7 bbuckler ONLINE  

bbuckler
  • Senior Member
  • Member No: 59269
  • 2,855 Thanks
  • 2,535 posts
  • Location: Killeen,Tx

Posted March 11, 2017 - 04:52 PM

   I have followed this thread and am not sure I understand. In your original post you say the reamer you used says to use 45 then 15 then finish 45. I am not sure what this means or how you interpreted it. Since you did not mention the brand or size of the engine you are working on we can't go to the manuals section and try to find the manufacturer's recommended valve and seat geometry. If the valve has to little contact with the seat it will leak and or over heat and burn prematurely. If the valve has to much contact with the seat it is also likely to leak and burn prematurely. My eyes have gotten old it is now necessary for me to use many different aids to inspect such things. I never go any place without reading glasses and my AA size led flash light. I have even gone so far  as to buy a USB microscope that I can plug into the lap top and bring the picture up on the screen magnified many hundreds of times. Brand name on mine says SupperEyes, $19.00 delivered if I remember right. Engine ID and more pictures would help. I would clean every thing thoroughly, coat the the seat with magic marker, put the valve in clean and turn it some then see what the marker looked like. In your original picture I'm guessing intake valve, I can only see one angle cut in the seat, if that angle is the same as the angle of the valve grind it will have full contact across the seat grind and that is probably not what the manufacturer recommends. Don      

Briggs and Stratton 325431-0139-99



#8 bbuckler ONLINE  

bbuckler
  • Senior Member
  • Member No: 59269
  • 2,855 Thanks
  • 2,535 posts
  • Location: Killeen,Tx

Posted March 11, 2017 - 05:49 PM

An easy way to check your work is to paint the valve seat with a magic marker.

 

After lapping the valve, you should see a nice, even, gray band where the ink was removed. 

 

A narrow (1/16") seat is acceptable for an intake valve, but the exhaust valve should have a wider contact area (approx. 3/32"-1/8").

 

The wider seat on the exhaust valve helps remove heat from the exhaust valve while it is closed.  ...The intake valve gets cooled by the incoming air/fuel mixture, so it does not rely on the seat as much to dissipate heat.

 

I tried doing it again but I can tell but it looks like it meeting at the 15 degrees but not the 45 degree I could be wrong.

 

With the marker on the seat

17238990_1384775144912819_213390807_n.jpg

 

Marker after lapping

17274642_1384775174912816_1920456307_n.jpg

 

Valve after lapping

17204375_1384775148246152_71033952_n.jpg

 

I still haven't lapped with the fine compound yet



#9 Stroud OFFLINE  

Stroud
  • Member
  • Member No: 53869
  • 131 Thanks
  • 53 posts
  • Location: sweet valley pa.

Posted March 11, 2017 - 05:50 PM

 Do a three angle with a 15 inside, 45 outside and a 35 seat  three angle with 3/32  contact area. Lap the valves by hand.


  • bbuckler said thank you

#10 bbuckler ONLINE  

bbuckler
  • Senior Member
  • Member No: 59269
  • 2,855 Thanks
  • 2,535 posts
  • Location: Killeen,Tx

Posted March 11, 2017 - 05:56 PM

 Do a three angle with a 15 inside, 45 outside and a 35 seat  three angle with 3/32  contact area. Lap the valves by hand.

The set I'm using don't have that. It a Sioux expanding seat reamer and it has a 1-1/2 45 degree, 1-9/16 15 degree and then another 1-1/2 45 degree to finish it.



#11 DougT OFFLINE  

DougT

    Dog Approved

  • Super Moderator
  • Staff
  • -GTt Supporter-
  • Contributor
  • Member No: 584
  • 6,571 Thanks
  • 4,743 posts
  • Location: north central Ohio

Posted March 11, 2017 - 08:10 PM

In the first pic, is the valve sitting below the deck or is it an optical illusion? One of your other pics gave me the impression that the top of the block was flycut around the valve seat? Has the seat been replaced before?

 

Second pic are we looking at the light color circle? It's a little dark at 12 O'clock but not hateful. What's going on at the 10-11 o'clock on the outside of the seat? Also a little around 8. Seat loose or blowing out around it?

 

3rd pic: Are we looking at the shiny there too, I hope? That looks like about the right width and position on the face of the valve that I'd look for. You don't need a fancy performance grind to make an old Briggs run, as long as it's hitting all the way around. Stroud's right about the 15* doing the inside. I was thinking bass ackwards. Anyway, if the shiny is where the contact is, and it looked like that all around, I'd run it. I'd make sure where the valve is setting in the block and that you get the clearance right. Just remember the first rule. It's a lot easier to take metal off than it is to put it back!!


  • Stroud and bbuckler have said thanks

#12 bbuckler ONLINE  

bbuckler
  • Senior Member
  • Member No: 59269
  • 2,855 Thanks
  • 2,535 posts
  • Location: Killeen,Tx

Posted March 11, 2017 - 08:31 PM

In the first pic, is the valve sitting below the deck or is it an optical illusion? One of your other pics gave me the impression that the top of the block was flycut around the valve seat? Has the seat been replaced before? - I think you are seeing the 15 degree cut that is a hair wider. I don't think so

 

Second pic are we looking at the light color circle? It's a little dark at 12 O'clock but not hateful. What's going on at the 10-11 o'clock on the outside of the seat? Also a little around 8. Seat loose or blowing out around it? -  Someone said it was water damaged. The seat was pitted too and that what it needed cut.

 

3rd pic: Are we looking at the shiny there too, I hope? That looks like about the right width and position on the face of the valve that I'd look for. You don't need a fancy performance grind to make an old Briggs run, as long as it's hitting all the way around. Stroud's right about the 15* doing the inside. I was thinking bass ackwards. Anyway, if the shiny is where the contact is, and it looked like that all around, I'd run it. I'd make sure where the valve is setting in the block and that you get the clearance right. Just remember the first rule. It's a lot easier to take metal off than it is to put it back!! -  Yep. it at 0.07 which is the min I'm going to grind off 0.01 and take it up to 0.08 . I will give it a leak down test after I finish and see if the valve is still leaking.



#13 Stroud OFFLINE  

Stroud
  • Member
  • Member No: 53869
  • 131 Thanks
  • 53 posts
  • Location: sweet valley pa.

Posted March 11, 2017 - 08:41 PM

 Just remember that as you dress the top of the valve to seat, if you take material off of the top you must correct the stem leangth of the valve to correctly seat.


  • bbuckler said thank you

#14 Stroud OFFLINE  

Stroud
  • Member
  • Member No: 53869
  • 131 Thanks
  • 53 posts
  • Location: sweet valley pa.

Posted March 11, 2017 - 09:03 PM

 I agree with DougT. Your valve does look like it has a good seat. Please correct me if the picture is illueding me, but it looks like it is sitting deep in the block. 


  • bbuckler said thank you

#15 Stroud OFFLINE  

Stroud
  • Member
  • Member No: 53869
  • 131 Thanks
  • 53 posts
  • Location: sweet valley pa.

Posted March 11, 2017 - 09:11 PM

 Sorry I was off on mt degrees. It is 15, 45, then 60.


  • bbuckler said thank you




Top