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Fuel and engine oil for older engines


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#31 Texas Deere and Horse OFFLINE  

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Posted August 23, 2016 - 11:31 PM

Bro you are full of it. My advice if you have no clue what you're talking about you should not be posting.


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You have been given 2 Warning Poimts for being rude, we don't put up with this kind of behavior here. Disagreement is good as long as you are polite about it!


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#32 Tecumseh power OFFLINE  

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Posted August 24, 2016 - 03:15 AM

Omg

#33 Tecumseh power OFFLINE  

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Posted August 24, 2016 - 03:30 AM

I want to try to simplify this for you
1. 87 octane is 87 regardless of it is ethanol or not. But it is lower btu that no ethanol fuel.
2. Ethanol won't hurt your engine itself but it will harm the rubber and plastic. Fuel lines carb seals etc.
3. If you are worried about zinc use diesel engine oil . Zinc was removed because it clogs catalytic converters on cars.
4. Lead lubes the valves and seats. And it also helped to lube the upper cyLinder. You can buy substitute for a few dollars .
5. Your piston scoring would not be from the fuel . But probably from dirt intake /oil contamination. Or improper engine rebuild.
Just wanted to try to make it as simple as possible for you. In my 13 years as a engine builder for a large equipment dealer I have taken many courses on fuels and oils. And you can get really in depth with this stuff more so than. You need to know to answer your questions. I tried to answer you without starting any arguung.and idk why the guy called bolens 1000 a bro. Everything he said was correct and he is a nice guy. No reason for him to act like that with him he was just trying to help . We don't need to act like that on here, AT All. We have a nice helpful community. That was rude, and for no reason. Anyway I hope this helps you

Edited by Tecumseh power, August 24, 2016 - 04:47 AM.

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#34 shorty ONLINE  

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Posted August 24, 2016 - 04:57 AM

I usually run regular ethanol blend gas over summer and try to get ethanol free for winter when not used as often.
I had visited with a fuel additives salesman one day. He politely informed me what all I need to watch for due to how it gets used. So armed with test kits and additives, my son checked all the gas tanks. Not one showed that it needed treatment.
It makes me wonder if how long the gas is at the service station and then in your can is the biggest difference in every one's experience. For instance, my reg blended fuel comes from a super busy station while the straight gas has to come from a pump that seas much less business.

#35 John Arsenault ONLINE  

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Posted August 24, 2016 - 05:45 AM

For the end user and anyone that does not want a scientific answer.

 

Ethanol is alcohol, alcohol dries  oils and rubber. When you shut your engine off the ethanol left behind starts drying the vital oils on your cylinder walls and valves. This occurs every time you shut your engine down. 

 

 

For those of you that think ethanol is harmless, try running an engine on 100% ethanol. You though run 100% gasoline. 

 

I have found that a little mmo in my gas will help combat the evaporation that occurs do to the alcohol.  Gasoline is a petroleum product and ethanol is an alcoholic based product and thats why you get what they call fuel separation. 

 

Many other good points have been made here, but remember ethanol is alcohol and alcohol dries. 

 

I can get into burn rate, octane and btu's , but thats not the issue with ethanol. 

 

So as far as the misconception that ethanol does not harm your engine , yes it does, slowly but surly every time you start it. The amount of wear may be minuscule, but it add up over the years.  


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#36 crazy eye OFFLINE  

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Posted August 24, 2016 - 07:15 AM

I want to try to simplify this for you
1. 87 octane is 87 regardless of it is ethanol or not. But it is lower btu that no ethanol fuel.
2. Ethanol won't hurt your engine itself but it will harm the rubber and plastic. Fuel lines carb seals etc.
3. If you are worried about zinc use diesel engine oil . Zinc was removed because it clogs catalytic converters on cars.
4. Lead lubes the valves and seats. And it also helped to lube the upper cyLinder. You can buy substitute for a few dollars .
5. Your piston scoring would not be from the fuel . But probably from dirt intake /oil contamination. Or improper engine rebuild.
Just wanted to try to make it as simple as possible for you. In my 13 years as a engine builder for a large equipment dealer I have taken many courses on fuels and oils. And you can get really in depth with this stuff more so than. You need to know to answer your questions. I tried to answer you without starting any arguung.and idk why the guy called bolens 1000 a bro. Everything he said was correct and he is a nice guy. No reason for him to act like that with him he was just trying to help . We don't need to act like that on here, AT All. We have a nice helpful community. That was rude, and for no reason. Anyway I hope this helps you

 100% agree on the low zinc content.  the usual place to find wear from low zinc oil is camshafts and tappets.  Diesel oil is still high zinc content at this point.  I run E-10 as the strait gas is hard to find around here.  I installed fuel shut off on anything that can have one installed.  EVERYTIME I'm done with a machine, I shut off the fuel, and run it dry.  I shoot some PB Blaster down the bowl vent for winter/long term storage.  if you can't shut off the fuel (carb mounted directly to the tank, drain it and run it dry, or at least use Stabil religiously.



#37 red79 OFFLINE  

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Posted August 24, 2016 - 12:31 PM

Geez, can't we all just get along?  And more importantly, what do I need to do to ensure my fuel choices are not damaging my engines?  I buy regular gas and only ever take 2 precautions: (1) I shut down my machines by hitting the fuel shut off and running the carb dry and (2) I stabilize any fuel that is left in the tank if storing for 2 months or more.

 

Should I be doing more, or am I likely taking enough precautions for long engine life?

 

Should I buy premium grade to minimize ethanol, or is premium grade problematic for other reasons?

 

Are additives really necessary (other than a little Seafoam when the carb is acting up)?

 

Thanks.


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#38 MiCarl ONLINE  

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Posted August 24, 2016 - 02:35 PM

Geez, can't we all just get along?  And more importantly, what do I need to do to ensure my fuel choices are not damaging my engines?  I buy regular gas and only ever take 2 precautions: (1) I shut down my machines by hitting the fuel shut off and running the carb dry and (2) I stabilize any fuel that is left in the tank if storing for 2 months or more.

 

Should I be doing more, or am I likely taking enough precautions for long engine life?

 

Should I buy premium grade to minimize ethanol, or is premium grade problematic for other reasons?

 

Are additives really necessary (other than a little Seafoam when the carb is acting up)?

 

Thanks.

I think you're probably doing all you can reasonably do.  I generally treat the fuel for even a couple weeks storage but don't drain the carburetors on the theory that they're designed to have fuel in them.....  On the other hand, if the carb has parts that the ethanol will degrade your method seems better for them.

 

BTW, I run diesel oil in my motorcycles to get the ZDDP.  My small engines don't get enough use to worry about camshaft/tappet wear while I'm still on this side of the grass.


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#39 heliosuk OFFLINE  

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Posted August 24, 2016 - 04:33 PM

You have been given 2 Warning Poimts for being rude, we don't put up with this kind of behavior here. Disagreement is good as long as you are polite about it!

 

I think this should now be put to bed. The "offender" has had the decency to  duly apologised and we should accept the apology in good grace. As someone in the know about complex engineering issues and passionate about the subject, I also find it difficult not to make sarcastic comments at times. The person has made some good and valid points and we should learn by this. Each to their own. The wonderful thing about this forum is I hope that we help each other and help means constructive comments and taking on board opinions.

 

So here's a little tale.

 

An engineer retires from a manufacturing company after 40 years service. His job was back filled by a young graduate who supposedly knew it all. After 6 months reports were coming in that something was wrong and for the life of them they couldn't work out what was wrong. So they called the rired engineer. He popped in to help them and to say hello to his colleagues. He watched what was happening and asked for a hammer. With the hammer he hit the machine and everything retuned to normal.

 

The company said thanks and let us know your expenses as we'll pay them. So he submits a bill for £10,000.

 

The company accountant gets in touch "you were only here 10 mins why the 10K bill.

 

The retired engineer responded  ok, here's a revised bill.

 

Attendance £2

 

Knowing exactly where to hit the machine £9,998.

 

Moral of the story is that experience and knowledge is king...it's jut the way it's put over.

 

Think about it!


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#40 MH81 ONLINE  

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Posted August 25, 2016 - 08:30 AM

since i got tore a new one for calling the BS, i'll politely explain.

duly noted. Since you called me out i do hope you give Cat a warning for telling me to shut my damm mouth, or that would be playing favorites wouldn't it?

I did have a discussion with the admins about why i was publicly called out and warned while another member in this thread posted "shut your damm mouth" and got no public shaming or warning. They simply removed his post and acted like it never happened. Cat received no warning, period, and his comment was much more direct and rude than mine.... There is something to be said about low post count and the treatment that is given, I completely understand how it would work that way, but wasn't pleased.

I have held my tongue to this point as I felt no need to get involved. It was being handled properly and if you were an adult about taking your medicine, this wouldn't have happened.

You are wrong. Cat received two points for abusive behavior and a dressing down by the admins.
The fact that you feel slighted in that you were publicly called out doesn't hold water anymore. Mainly because you continue to play the poor me card and bring it up AGAIN. The argument that "I shouldn't be punished because he did it too" holds less sway with me than most of the political arguments of today. You are baiting, and unfortunately for you, the rudeness, disrespect in PM's and disdain for the staff here has caught you a bigger fish than you prepared bait or line for.

I will not say all the things I want to. Most of them involve maturity and the hope that some finds you. Yesterday, you said you were done with this place and the people here. You were going to go elsewhere and post.

I am here to help you in that.

Goodbye.
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#41 Paulgo ONLINE  

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Posted August 25, 2016 - 03:47 PM

So... My engines are all from the 70's and 80's. Is there any reason NOT to run 91 octane premium in them? That is the only ethanol free gas available up here.


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#42 propane1 ONLINE  

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Posted August 25, 2016 - 05:07 PM

Good question. Again I'm interested in the comments.

Noel

#43 MiCarl ONLINE  

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Posted August 25, 2016 - 06:19 PM

Other than damage to your wallet I'm not aware of any reason not to use the higher octane fuel.


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#44 Paulgo ONLINE  

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Posted August 25, 2016 - 06:49 PM

A gas retailer lists reasons not to use ethanol in older engines.

 

http://blarneycastle...EE_GASOLINE.pdf


Edited by Paulgo, August 25, 2016 - 08:22 PM.


#45 Texas Deere and Horse OFFLINE  

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Posted August 25, 2016 - 08:11 PM

For the record, I used to use pump gas with 10% E. I was constantly fighting carb and fuel pump issues if I let them sit for a few weeks. I started adding "Seafoam" and the problems went basically away. One day I stopped at the local air field and found avgas was almost as cheap as my "Treated gas", so now I only use Avgas in everything and wow what a difference it makes. No issues at all no matter if the engine sits 6 months. And My Kohler's run better and I feel like they run stronger also, I also love the smell of the exhaust on Avgas.
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