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Recovering A Bowl Or Dish Style Seat Pan With The Crimped Outer Edge

seat upholstery tractor seat repair tractor seat recover how to repair a garden tracto

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#1 29 Chev ONLINE  

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Posted June 14, 2016 - 07:24 PM

Since a few members showed interest in the post I did on how to recover a lawn tractor seat I thought I would start one on how to recover the "Bowl" or "Dish" style seat pan that some lawn tractors such as (Bolens and Simplicity) used starting in the 1960's that featured a padded seat with a cover that is held on at the outer edges by the outer edge or lip of the seat being crimped down on the material.

 

Please note this information is provided as is - use at your own risk.

 

Please use proper safety protection such as safety glasses, masks and gloves when working on seats and work in a safe manner - remember a second of thoughtlessness can result in a lifetime of suffering.

 

For this post I will be using a metal seat pan off of a Bolens 900 garden tractor - what can I say I am a Bolens addict.

 

Here are some pictures of what a typical seat looks like after fifty plus years - reasonably solid metal pan but very little left of the cover or padding -  and how it can look after being recovered.

Attached Thumbnails

  • 1 Seat 1 Bottom.jpg
  • 3 Seat 1 Top.jpg
  • 4 Seat 1 Side.jpg
  • 5 Seat 1 Front.jpg
  • 6 Seat 1 Side.jpg
  • 1 Seat Front View.jpg
  • 2 Seat Corner View.jpg
  • 3 Side View.jpg
  • 4 Top View.jpg
  • 5 Side View.jpg

Edited by 29 Chev, June 15, 2016 - 10:07 AM.

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#2 KennyP ONLINE  

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Posted June 14, 2016 - 07:28 PM

That looks real nice!


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#3 29 Chev ONLINE  

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Posted June 14, 2016 - 07:48 PM

This thread will concentrate on how to remove the original cover without damaging the outer lip, how to make a cover that will conform to the curved areas of the pan and look reasonably good as well as how to install and shape the padding to conform to the curves of the seat pan and finally how to close the lip back up again to retain the new cover leaving no sharp edges and very few marks.

 

For details on sewing the pleats you may wish to refer to the other thread - http://gardentractor...a-lawn-tractor/ as I will touch on them in this thread but there will be more detailed information in the other thread. 

 

A lot of people tend to simply cut off the remains of the old cover, clean up the seat pan by removing the rust and painting it and then either installing the seat back on the tractor as a painted seat or simply putting a pull over cover on top of the seat pan.  While there is nothing wrong with these methods it is my hope that this post will educate the reader on how to spread the outer edge or lip apart, remove the remains of the old cover, install a new cover and close the lip back up again providing a seat that looks very close to what the original looked like.  This method will take a bit of time and patience but I think in the end the seat will look much nicer if it is a tractor that you are planning on restoring.

 

If you are interested read on and I will try and update this post as time permits and share some of the tricks that I have learned work (at least for me) as well as some that I thought would work and didn't. 


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#4 29 Chev ONLINE  

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Posted June 14, 2016 - 07:59 PM

Here are a couple of pictures of what the Bolens seat looked like with an original cover - the material was heat formed to the padding and had a pleated area where the bottom of your butt would sit on it.  The first picture shows that duct tape has been used to try and retain the cover and prevent further deterioration and the others show that the material has let go around the outer edge and the results of this - like a lot of things vinyl has a life span and unfortunately it gets hard and brittle with age and these seats show the signs of a seat cover that is past its "best by" date.

Attached Thumbnails

  • Original 900 Seat Cover.jpg
  • post-8592-0-17944200-1461704346.jpg
  • post-8592-0-56002500-1461704372.jpg
  • post-8592-0-73826500-1461704362.jpg

Edited by 29 Chev, June 14, 2016 - 08:43 PM.

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#5 29 Chev ONLINE  

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Posted June 14, 2016 - 08:32 PM

The first step once the seat has been removed from the tractor is to select a work area that will accommodate the seat - bigger is better - I use a table I made out of a few 2x4's and some chip board for a top.  I would suggest you put a piece of cardboard underneath the seat pan as this will allow you to move the seat around without scratching or marking the seat pan or the work surface you have chosen.  Next you will need two tools - one is used to spread the lip and the other is used to close the lip back down again.  The tools I use are home made by modifying two pairs of vise grips that the jaws were worn out on as I am frugal and I have not found anyone that actually offers these as a tool for sale - if you can find them already made and can afford them feel free to purchase them and also provide information as to who is making them.  I will show you how I made mine out of two pairs of vise grips that the jaws were worn on in the next few posts. 

 

You may be tempted to use a chisel or screw driver to spread the lip apart but I do not recommend this as they are hard to start under the tightly closed lip and will usually mark up, distort and sometimes even rip the metal at the lip - I speak from experience which is why I made the tools.  Similarly you may be tempted to use a pair of vise grips or pliers to close the lip back up again - don't do it as the grooves in the jaws will mark up the seat lip and in the case of pliers you will probably not have enough leverage to close up the lip - most seats use about 16 gauge steel.  You may also be tempted to use a wooden or dead blow hammer to close up the lip - they will close up the lip but are hard to control as far as the amount you bend the lip and if you have the vinyl in the groove they may pinch and cut the material against the metal lip as you strike the lip with the hammer (ask me how I know).

 

The two tools are fairly easy to make, allow you to control the amount of pressure you are placing on the metal lip and also check that you are not causing any damage to the new cover material or the metal lip if used with patience and common sense.   

Attached Thumbnails

  • 5 Modified Vise Grips.jpg
  • 6 Modified Vise Grips.jpg
  • 9 Modified Vise Grips For Squeezing Lip Closed.jpg
  • 1 Closer.jpg

Edited by 29 Chev, June 15, 2016 - 02:12 PM.

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#6 29 Chev ONLINE  

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Posted June 15, 2016 - 02:32 PM

First comes the construction of the tool I will call the spreader - It uses two pieces of 1/2" x 1/8" angle iron welded on to the jaws of a pair of #10 vise grips with a curved jaw.  You may wish to use a smaller size of vise grips but I find the #10 gives you a bit more leverage with the longer handles which can be helpful when trying to spread 16 gauge steel.  The first piece is about 3/4" long and forms a lower jaw that rests against the seat pan lip and the second piece that is about 1/2" long  forms the upper chisel shaped tooth that is forced under the seat lip as the handles of the vise grips are closed and starts to spread it apart.  The nice thing about the vise grips is that you can adjust the amount the jaws close so that you can control how much of a bite you take depending on the seat lips position (closed, starting to open, half way open, etc.).  As you can see in figure # 9 the lower jaw is clamped as shown and then welded in position.  I used a mig welder but the angle iron piece could also be brazed or soldered to the vise grip jaw.  If you look at picture #10 I originally positioned the chisel shaped tooth too close to the lower piece of angle iron and as a result I had to reposition it as shown in picture #11 - there should be approximately a 3/16" space between the two pieces of angle iron as shown in picture #5.  I would suggest welding the angle iron that is used to form the chisel tooth on to the vise grips first and then filing or grinding the edge of the angle iron to form the chisel tooth profile as shown in picture #3.  Once you have the two angle iron pieces welded on and the chisel tooth profile shaped inspect all the surfaces that will contact the seat lip - remove any burrs, rough edges or weld splatter as you want these surfaces smooth so they will not mark the seat pan lip.

Attached Thumbnails

  • 1 Spreader.jpg
  • 2 Spreader.jpg
  • 3 Spreader.jpg
  • 4 Spreader.jpg
  • 5 Gap Between Two Pieces Of Angle Iron.jpg
  • 6 Half Inch Angle Iron.jpg
  • 7 WIdth Of Lower Angle Iron.jpg
  • 8 Width Of Upper Angle Iron Chisel Tooth.jpg
  • 9 Lower Jaw Clamped In Position To Be Welded.jpg
  • 10 Original Tooth Spacing Too Close.jpg
  • 11 Tooth Spacing Widened.jpg

Edited by 29 Chev, June 15, 2016 - 02:44 PM.

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#7 29 Chev ONLINE  

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Posted June 15, 2016 - 02:53 PM

Since we are making tools might as well make the second one which I will call the closer.  It is also made out of a pair of #10 vise grips with the curved jaws.  To make this tool two pieces of 1/8" x 1" flat steel are welded to the jaws of the vise grips - as you can see in the pictures the steel was brazed to the jaws as this tool was actually made back before I had a mig welder and was used to bend sheet steel for body work.  The lower piece of steel is 4" long and the upper piece is 1" long (it originally was 4" long as well but I trimmed it to work better for the seat lip application - you will see why when we get to closing up the lip).  The two pieces of steel can be centered, clamped in the jaws and then welded to them as shown.  Once they are welded inspect the surfaces and remove any weld splatter or sharp edges - again you want the surfaces smooth so they will not mark up the seat pan lip. 

Attached Thumbnails

  • 1 Closer.jpg
  • 2 Closer Jaws CLosed.jpg
  • 3 Closer.jpg
  • 4 Length Of Lower Jaw.jpg
  • 5 Length Of Upper Jaw.jpg
  • 6 Width Of Jaws.jpg
  • 7 Thickness Of Jaws.jpg

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Posted June 15, 2016 - 04:04 PM

Now you can begin to spread the seat lip using the spreader tool.  The original seat cover usually has a welt material that the vinyl is wrapped around and this is what is under the outer lip as shown in pictures #11 and #12 - when the lip was squeezed shut at the factory the vinyl was squeezed around the welt and trapped so it could not pull out from under the metal.  The spreader tooth is placed as shown in picture #1 and then the handles are squeezed together to force the tooth under the metal lip and start it to lift.  Adjust the screw on the vise grips so that when you squeeze the handles together you are only forcing the tooth in a little bit under the metal - be gentle and take your time as you only want to start to lift the lip on the initial pass around the edge.  Work your way around the lip moving about 3/4" along each time you reposition the tool and squeeze the tooth under the lip.  Do not take too big of a bite and try and spread the lip wide apart on this pass as that will stretch and deform the metal - you want to spread it apart a little bit at a time uniformly.  Be especially careful at the two lower front corners as the 90 degree corner makes the metal harder to move and you can rip or tear the metal if you try to bring it too much in one spot - a little bit at a time and a  few passes will spread the lip with very little distortion or marking of the metal.   Once you have made the first pass the lip should be up a little bit as shown in picture #5 and you can tighten the screw a little bit and do another pass around the outside - you may have to do three or four passes around the outer edge to get it spread wide enough. As you make the second and other passes make sure the tooth is engaged down in the trough channel and spreading the lip metal at the bottom of the trough the material is trapped in - you do not want the tooth to pull on the outer edge of the lip as this will make the lip curve from the edge of the lip to the trough.  Once the lip is spread enough as shown in pictures #7 and #8 you can take a small flat screwdriver and lift the material out of the trough - if it is still trapped you may have to spread the lip a little bit more.  Once you have the material removed as shown in picture #13 you should have a seat pan that has an outer lip spread apart with minimal distortion as shown in picture #14.  Give yourself a pat on the back - you are well on your way to having a seat that will look beautiful and that you can be proud of when you explain to people how you did it yourself. 

 

Note: As you can see in the pictures the lip on this seat pan has small holes drilled in it along the outer edge.   This is not normal - someone drilled them and put stove bolts though a replacement cover to hold it in place.  If you notice the metal cracked or ripped at some of the holes during the process of spreading the lip on this particular seat.  I welded the holes back in and then ground the welds to repair the seat pan lip and return it to the way it was made originally.       

Attached Thumbnails

  • 1 Starting To Spread Lip.jpg
  • 2 Working Way Along Edge.jpg
  • 3 Working Way Along Edge.jpg
  • 4 Working Across The Back.jpg
  • 5 Around Edge Once.jpg
  • 6 Around Edge Twice.jpg
  • 7 Close Up Of Lip Spread Wide Enough To Remove Old Material.jpg
  • 8 Close Up Of Lip Spread Wide Enough To Remove Old Material.jpg
  • 9 Material Removed From Lip.jpg
  • 10 Material Removed From Lip.jpg
  • 11 Welt Inside Of Old Vinyl.jpg
  • 12 Welt Inside Of Old Vinyl.jpg
  • 13 Old Material From Lip.jpg
  • 14 Seat Pan Lip Spread And Ready For Clean Up.jpg

Edited by 29 Chev, June 15, 2016 - 04:11 PM.

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Posted June 15, 2016 - 04:31 PM

Now you have a metal seat to work with and you can switch over to bodywork mode and repair any rust, dents and other imperfections - hopefully your seat pan is in better shape that the one I worked with - as you can see in the pictures this one had a screen door problem once I started cleaning it up with a wire brush.  I would suggest sandblasting the seat if you have access to the equipment but a wire bush will also work.  I welded in the holes along the outer lip that someone had drilled and also filled in the rust holes, ground the welds and eventually had a seat pan that was clean and solid.  Make sure that any mounting holes are in good shape and if they have nuts welded that the nuts are secure and the threads clean and solid - now is the time to find and fix these problems - not when you are trying to install the seat back on the tractor.  A quick thread chasing with a tap now may save a lot of grief later.

Attached Thumbnails

  • 1 Seat Pan Wire Brushed.jpg
  • 2 Closer View Of Pan.jpg
  • 3 Lip Spread Wider To Clean Out Trough.jpg
  • 4 Rear View.jpg
  • 5 Holes Welded.jpg
  • 6 Holes Welded.jpg
  • 7 Holes Welded.jpg
  • 8 Holes Welded.jpg
  • 9 Holes Welded.jpg
  • 10 Holes Welded.jpg
  • 1 Welds Ground First Time.jpg
  • 2 Welds Ground Second Time.jpg
  • 3 Back Side.jpg

Edited by 29 Chev, June 15, 2016 - 04:59 PM.

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#10 diesel nut ONLINE  

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Posted June 15, 2016 - 08:44 PM

Nice write up on how to fix those old seats and how to make the tools.  The second tool with the flat jaws looks a lot like one I have at work for welding.  It's made by Irwin and is on Amazon for around $15.  The only difference I can see is yours looks to close completely flat instead of the outer edge touching and opening on a taper to the inside with the Irwin vise-grip.  Here's a pic of what the one I have looks like.                 Stewart

irwin vise grip.jpg


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#11 29 Chev ONLINE  

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Posted June 16, 2016 - 01:44 PM

Thanks for the input - those are the 8R duck bill plier that vise grip has available for sheet metal work - http://www.irwin.com...eet-metal-tools.  I do have a pair of those and they work very well for bending and shaping lighter metal such as body steel.  I have tried them on the lip of a seat pan and I find they are a little on the light side for trying to squeeze the metal lip closed.  The handles are not as long as the tool that I use which gives me a bit more leverage to bend the heavier 16 gauge steel lip.  I also have arthritis in my hands so for me the homemade tool is easier to squeeze as it takes less force.  Another problem with the sheet metal tool is that both the top and bottom "duck bill" are the same width - if you look closely at the tool I made the top bill is only 1" wide and as a result you are not trying to bend as much of the lip at one time as there is less surface contact with the shorter bill.  Also there is less likely hood of the seat metal bending on the back side as the longer bill goes against the back side of the seat (except when doing the corners) and has more surface area contact there causing the outer lip to bend first.  They may work along the side and back if your hands are strong enough but would not fit into a tight bend very well that the front two corner areas have.  The tool I made actually gets flipped around when working on the corner areas as the 1" wide bill does a nice job of allowing you to close up the corner a little bit at a time and in the corners the wider bill only contacts a small amount of the outer metal lip when you go to squeeze them closed as you will see.   Attached are pictures of the two tools side by side.    

Attached Thumbnails

  • 1 Sheet Metal Tool Beside Home Made Closer.jpg
  • 2 Sheet Metal Tool Beside Home Made Closer.jpg
  • 3 Sheet Metal Tool Beside Home Made Closer.jpg

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#12 29 Chev ONLINE  

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Posted June 16, 2016 - 02:05 PM

Once you have the seat pan cleaned up and solid you can prep it for painting.  Since the seat pan I used had a lot of pits and scratches I used a good quality automotive body filler to fill in the pits and other imperfections.  I also used a self etching primer around the trough area of the outer edge where the welt goes to keep it from rusting in the future as well as on the seat once I had the filler levelled and sanded.  If you have imperfections in the outer part of the seat pan or lip that will be visible once the seat is finished (cover installed and lip closed) I would recommend that you wait until after the cover is installed and the lip squeezed back together before using any body filler, spot putty or primer in this area as they may crack, break away or be damaged from the closer tool during the clamping action.  The outer edge and back side of the seat can have body filler applied carefully once you are done squeezing the lip shut and then the final prep and priming can be done along the edge before you paint the seat. 

Attached Thumbnails

  • 1 Body FIller Applied On Front.jpg
  • 2 Outer Lip Sprayed With Self Etching Primer.jpg
  • 3 Outer Edge.jpg
  • 4 Outer Edge.jpg
  • 5 Outer Edge.jpg
  • 6 Body Filler Levelled.jpg
  • 7 Sprayed With Self Etching Primer.jpg

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#13 29 Chev ONLINE  

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Posted June 16, 2016 - 02:11 PM

As you can see in these pictures I have most of the back and side areas of the seat filled and primed as this will reduce the final prep time once the cover is installed and these areas should not be damaged or marked by the closer tool.  It is difficult to prevent the primer from getting on the outer lip but this area will be sanded and cleaned once the lip is closed to make sure the paint has a nice smooth, solid surface to bond to. 

Attached Thumbnails

  • 1 Metal Filler.jpg
  • 2 First Coat Of Filler APplied.jpg
  • 3 Second Coat Applied And Sanded.jpg
  • 4 Third Coat Applied And Sanded.jpg
  • 5 First Coat Of Primer.jpg
  • 6 First Coat Of Primer.jpg


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Posted June 16, 2016 - 03:44 PM

Once you have your seat pan to the point that you are happy with it cosmetically you can concentrate on the padding.  The seat I worked with had no padding but I was fortunate enough to find another seat that did have what appeared to be the original padding still intact.  As you can see in the pictures it has seen better days and has deteriorated around the outer edge but it did provide me with an idea of the thickness and how it was shaped.  I would strongly recommend that you purchase some new foam and make new padding - it is not that much more of an expense and will give you a nicer looking seat when done.  The original padding measured 1" thick and was molded to the shape of the seat pan - probably it was molded to the cover as well originally. 

Attached Thumbnails

  • 1 Another Seat WIth Original Padding.jpg
  • 2 Another Seat WIth Original Padding.jpg
  • 3 Padding Thickness.jpg


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Posted June 16, 2016 - 07:10 PM

To make the padding I used two pieces of 1/2" thick foam Grade 2545.  The first piece was glued to the seat pan and then the second piece was glued to the first piece - you can also use 1" thick foam but you may find using the two 1/2" pieces easier to shape to the seat pan.  I would recommend using a good hi temperature glue designed to attach headliners and other heavy materials - I used a 3M product Super Trim Adhesive Part # 08090.  If you use a regular trim adhesive the padding may stick initially but if the seat is exposed to the hot sun it may loose its bond.  You need to locate the centre of the seat pan and mark it with a marker - also measure the seat pan front to back and side to side following the contour of the seat pan to determine the size of foam you need - add about 2" to each measurement as it is easier to trim a little excess than it is to add padding.  Once you have the foam marked out and cut you can determine the centre and mark it on the padding. After you do this you can try the padding on the seat pan and push down on it with your hand to give you an idea of how it will mold to the shape of the seat - it will probably pucker a bit at the sides as you can see in picture #4.  Line up the centre marks of the padding and seat pan and keep the front edge of the foam even with the very front of the seat lip - that way you should have enough padding at the front and rear and along the sides.  You may wish to mark where the puckering starts on the back of the foam as well as on the seat pan as shown in pictures #5 and #6.  Once these areas are marked make sure everything is clean and dry and apply adhesive to the back of the foam and padding stopping at the marks where the puckering started - these can be glued once you get the padding stuck to the seat.  I would suggest that once you have the adhesive applied to the padding to fold it in half and clamp it as shown in picture #9.  Once the adhesive is ready (follow the manufacturers directions) you can stick the padding to the front of the bottom area of the seat making sure the centre lines match and that the front sedge of the padding is even with the very front of the seat lip as shown in picture #11.  You can then put your hand on top of the centre area of the padding starting at the front and apply even pressure to the padding so it sticks to the seat pan and work your way towards the back and then up the backside of the seat pan as shown in picture #12.  Undo the two clamps and using your hand apply even pressure starting at the centre and working your way out to each edge and push the padding so it is stuck to the seat pan - be careful that the padding does not get any wrinkles or puckers (if it does pull the padding away from the seat pan and reshape it with your hand)  and that the padding conforms to the seat pan shape and is stuck evenly from the centre out as shown in pictures #13 and #14. 

Attached Thumbnails

  • 1 Seat Pan Marked WIth Centre Line.jpg
  • 2 Half Inch Padding.jpg
  • 3 Centre Line Marked On Padding.jpg
  • 4 Test Fit Of Padding.jpg
  • 5 Marks Where Padding Starts To Pucker.jpg
  • 6 Marks Where Padding Starts To Pucker.jpg
  • 7 Padding Area Marked For Glue.jpg
  • 8 Seat Pan Area Marked For Glue.jpg
  • 9 Line Up Centre Mark To Install.jpg
  • 10 Line Up Centre Mark To Install.jpg
  • 11 Front Edge Of Foam At Edge Of Pan.jpg
  • 12 Foam PAdding Pressed Down At Butt Area.jpg
  • 13 Stuck At Back And SIdes.jpg
  • 14 Stuck At Back And SIdes.jpg
  • 9 Stronger Glue.jpg

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