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HELP, Need ideas, please...


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#1 broken arrow OFFLINE  

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Posted June 06, 2016 - 11:59 AM

This is not a relaxing situation for me.
I need to cut a 1.5 inch black plastic pipe off at 175 feet down a well casing.
I have a well pump going bad at 380 feet deep.
I can't pull the pump because the well has collapsed at 175 feet plus.
I have clean water from 35 feet down to the 175 foot level.
If I can get the pipe to snap at the 175 foot mark, I can go with either another submersible pump at that level or go with a jet pump set-up.
Any ideas? 
I need help.
I have a wife that thinks that water is an important part of a happy existence.
Thanks for looking (laughing),
Dave


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#2 Auburn David OFFLINE  

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Posted June 06, 2016 - 12:44 PM

My Buddy modified a cylinder hone in some fashion and mounted it on PVC pipe to cut his when it collapsed..not sure how deep he had to go with his..but it worked good for him.I know he first tried it with razor knife blades but ended up using some sort of little small hobbie saw blades that he attached to the hone some how.He tied the hone closed with a bow with nylon string and when he got to where the cut needed to be just pulled the string and the hone expanded..(he turned this slowly with his drill from the topside.


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#3 Auburn David OFFLINE  

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Posted June 06, 2016 - 12:46 PM

I also recall he put tennis balls on the PVC shaft every so many feet to keep it from wobbling to bad..


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#4 Auburn David OFFLINE  

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Posted June 06, 2016 - 12:47 PM

guess Styrofoam balls could be used as well.



#5 Auburn David OFFLINE  

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Posted June 06, 2016 - 12:50 PM

used this type blade as I recall.

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#6 boyscout862 OFFLINE  

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Posted June 06, 2016 - 02:26 PM

I'd check with my local plumber or well driller. Chances are that one of them already has a good way to do it. I would expect something that goes inside the pipe, is on a strong rope, and expands when the rope is pulled. It would cut and hold the pipe at the same time. Good Luck, Rick

#7 CanadianHobbyFarmer OFFLINE  

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Posted June 06, 2016 - 03:52 PM

How big is your well casing? I doubt you could fit another submersible in beside the existing line, but you may be able to get the injector assembly for a deep well jet pump in there with no need to remove the existing line. 

 

Jim



#8 Bruce Dorsi OFFLINE  

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Posted June 06, 2016 - 03:53 PM

Can you exert enough of a twist and upward-pull on the pipe to cause it to come off the pump?

 

Is the well large enough to possibly twist, stretch, & break the pipe inside the well and install a new pipe alongside the broken pipe? ....Depending on where the pipe separates, you may be able to re-use your existing pipe, or add to it.



#9 WNYTractorTinkerer ONLINE  

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Posted June 06, 2016 - 06:15 PM

Can you exert enough of a twist and upward-pull on the pipe to cause it to come off the pump?

 

Is the well large enough to possibly twist, stretch, & break the pipe inside the well and install a new pipe alongside the broken pipe? ....Depending on where the pipe separates, you may be able to re-use your existing pipe, or add to it.

Collapsed well casing = bad news for sure!

 

A slip knot and a tractor loader ought to pull whatever part of the exposed pipe right out of there..  The alternative would be the well driller to come and drill down to the collapse.. then you can put in a new pump and hose..  **Are you sure you will have water @ 175' all year long?  There was a reason the well was 300' in the first place I surmise..  Talk to a driller first is the best advice or try the brute force approach!

 

ood Luck and remember to share what you did..  We other well owners are interested! 


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#10 broken arrow OFFLINE  

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Posted June 07, 2016 - 08:48 AM

Hi all,

I'll fill in some details...

The well is 380 feet deep because the original owners bought a large property with plans for a trailer park, drilled a well that would feed all the trailers, then went to the township for approval.

The township said no way, it does not meet codes.

The property was then split up into 1 acre lots.

I bought the lot with the large well.

Way overkill for a single family dwelling.

The neighboring wells are 65 to 100 feet deep.

 

I can't drop another pump or pipe in beside the one there because there are pipe isolators every 8 to 10 feet.

I have checked with the local well drillers (over 70 years experience) and they do not have anything that will go in and cut the pipe.

The problem with trying to pull the pipe and snap it is that it will probably snap 10 feet down instead of 175 feet down.

That would make the well un-usable at that point. (other than grinding it out)

 

I have water at this time, but....

Since the pump can't produce more than 30 pounds pressure, it wants to run all the time.

So, we have to turn on the pump when we need water and turn it off when we don't.

I found this problem when I opened my electric bill.

The usually $40 bill was $170 because the pump was running continuously trying to make the pressure switch setting.

A check valve at the top of the casing is working and holding pressure.

 

I am a blacksmith by profession so I'm work on ideas that will get the pipe to snap at the required level.

But, I would like to be closer to a 100% chance of success.

 

We have lived here for over 22 years so I guess we are lucky not to have had any other water problems.

It would have been nice if we could have replaced the pump and moved on.

 

I'll let you know how it turns out.

In the meantime, keep the ideas coming.

Thanks,

Dave


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#11 MH81 ONLINE  

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Posted June 07, 2016 - 11:21 AM

If it breaks at the 10' mark, You should be able to have the well redrilled to the 170' level. It will get the pipe out of the way and possibly even open it up?

#12 bh115577 OFFLINE  

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Posted June 07, 2016 - 12:53 PM

Just a shot in the dark if it'll work but.......

 

Get a steam or hot water pressure washer and as much hose as needed to reach the depth you want.

 

Pick up one of these jetting nozzles http://www.ultimatew...wer-nozzles.htm or something like it. Could even make one that only sprays toward the sides.

 

Get the water in the hose hot and drop it in the hole to your depth.

 

Fire it up and let the nozzle over heat the pipe (suppose it could do some cutting as well) and it might just pull apart at the hot point. Ours at work gets close to 300 degrees.

 

A bit of a risk involved but if the well driller didn't have anything it might be worth a shot.



#13 Bruce Dorsi OFFLINE  

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Posted June 07, 2016 - 08:04 PM

Before you think I'm nuts:

 

A small cutter like David pictured attached to the end of a cable could be lowered inside the existing poly pipe to the 175' depth. 

 

A drill attached to the top end of the cable could rotate the cutter inside the pipe to weaken, or hopefully, sever the pipe.

 

A weight slid on the cable above the cutter, should keep tension on the cable, and keep the cutter at a constant depth.  .....A collar (larger than the diameter of the poly pipe) can be clamped at the top of the poly pipe to limit the depth of the cutter, and keep the cable from dropping into the abyss.

 

Ideally, a rod would be more stable than a cable, but trying to get 175' of rod could be a problem (cost & availability).

 

If this idea sounds feasible to you, I can give you (FREE) 200' of stainless wire rope approx. 1/8"-3/16" diameter.  ....I could probably help with an arbor to mount a cutter, and a collar for the top of the cable.

 

The s/s cable can later be used as a safety cable to suspend a new pump.

 

I'm approx. 2-1/2 hours from Lancaster (town), but I could possibly meet you somewhere in between.


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#14 toomanytoys84 OFFLINE  

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Posted June 08, 2016 - 07:06 AM

My Buddy modified a cylinder hone in some fashion and mounted it on PVC pipe to cut his when it collapsed..not sure how deep he had to go with his..but it worked good for him.I know he first tried it with razor knife blades but ended up using some sort of little small hobbie saw blades that he attached to the hone some how.He tied the hone closed with a bow with nylon string and when he got to where the cut needed to be just pulled the string and the hone expanded..(he turned this slowly with his drill from the topside.

 

I understand everything he did here, but my question is how in the heck did he turn the hobby saw blade with his drill?

 

Did he have a flexible extension that was really long?  Also, the hobby saw blade would have to be a smaller diameter than the pipe, when the hone expanded how did he get the blade to engage the pipe?

 

I'm just curious, I'd love to see this setup.  Seems almost like something he could patent and sell!  I did a quick google search and its amazing how many other people have the exact same problem.


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#15 greenb69 ONLINE  

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Posted June 08, 2016 - 08:06 AM

Most modern water well drillers use what is called a hammer drill and would be useless in your case. The old cable tool rig would also not work. A rotary drill with a tricone bit would chew up anything in the hole to the depth that you want. In the oil field we would what we call shoot a hole in the casing. A roll of wire and a small charge could blow the pipe into at the precise depth. Not so much that you cause another colaps though.

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