Jump to content

Nominations for Tractor of the Month
Garden Tractors and Parts on eBay



Photo
- - - - -

Trouble starting 3 cyl Yanmar in 455 JD


  • Please log in to reply
15 replies to this topic

#1 Alberta Bolens OFFLINE  

Alberta Bolens
  • Senior Member
  • Member No: 49650
  • 442 Thanks
  • 251 posts
  • Location: Alberta Canada

Posted February 01, 2016 - 03:44 PM

Good Day.

 

Last week I brought my 455 from cold storage shed up to the shop.  I put tarp over it and little electric heater under it and boost and it started right up.  Now I have had it in the shop done some work on it and it won't start.  I have the tarp on it with heater going boosting it.  Inside a heated shop.

 

It has fuel in it.

Boosting it so lots of power

Glow plugs are working.

It smokes white and does fire on smokes black.  Lots of smoke

It fire and almost run but will not catch.

Reading the service manual these are supposed to be self bleeding.

Has factory electric fuel pump which is working.

Tarp with elec heater in heated building

Has no elec fuel solenoid it been converted to manuel and all the linkage is in place and getting full movement  on the shut off.

I put new file filter in last spring and have not looked at it as it started when I brought it into the shop.

 

It has lots of blow by so I'm guessing compression isn't at peak.  But it started with only dozen turns at only few degree above freezing with heater under tarp.  I can't figure why it won't start now. :wallbanging: .  It should flash up.

 

Other than loosening injector lines is there any trick to bleeding the little beast??


Edited by Alberta Bolens, February 01, 2016 - 04:13 PM.

  • ROBKa said thank you

#2 chieffan ONLINE  

chieffan
  • Senior Member
  • Contributor
  • Member No: 62695
  • 6,147 Thanks
  • 4,491 posts
  • Location: SW Iowa

Posted February 01, 2016 - 04:04 PM

Sounds like you short on compression since you mentioned it has a lot of blow by.  You can try pulling the glow plugs and put 1 squirt of warm oil in each cylinder.  Don't overdo the oil though, just one squirt and let it sit a while to let the oil settle down around the piston to the rings. The oil might seal the rings enough that it will start.  Your not going to want to do this each time though.


  • Trav1s said thank you

#3 HANKG OFFLINE  

HANKG
  • Senior Member
  • Contributor
  • Member No: 29484
  • 4,877 Thanks
  • 2,791 posts
  • Location: Pt.Pleasant N.J.

Posted February 01, 2016 - 05:58 PM

Was the fuel tank full before you brought it inside and warmed it up ?

#4 Alberta Bolens OFFLINE  

Alberta Bolens
  • Senior Member
  • Member No: 49650
  • 442 Thanks
  • 251 posts
  • Location: Alberta Canada

Posted February 01, 2016 - 07:58 PM

Was the fuel tank full before you brought it inside and warmed it up ?

No about 1/3 of tank.  Are you thinking condensation?  



#5 Alberta Bolens OFFLINE  

Alberta Bolens
  • Senior Member
  • Member No: 49650
  • 442 Thanks
  • 251 posts
  • Location: Alberta Canada

Posted February 01, 2016 - 08:12 PM

Good Day.

 

Last week I brought my 455 from cold storage shed up to the shop.  I put tarp over it and little electric heater under it and boost and it started right up.  Now I have had it in the shop done some work on it and it won't start.  I have the tarp on it with heater going boosting it.  Inside a heated shop.

 

It has fuel in it.

Boosting it so lots of power

Glow plugs are working.

It smokes white and does fire on smokes black.  Lots of smoke

It fire and almost run but will not catch.

Reading the service manual these are supposed to be self bleeding.

Has factory electric fuel pump which is working.

Tarp with elec heater in heated building

Has no elec fuel solenoid it been converted to manuel and all the linkage is in place and getting full movement  on the shut off.

I put new file filter in last spring and have not looked at it as it started when I brought it into the shop.

 

It has lots of blow by so I'm guessing compression isn't at peak.  But it started with only dozen turns at only few degree above freezing with heater under tarp.  I can't figure why it won't start now. :wallbanging: .  It should flash up.

 

Other than loosening injector lines is there any trick to bleeding the little beast??

Little further exploration this afternoon.  I had it warm enough the temp gauge was registering It turns and fires occasionally when fires lots of darker smoke fair amount of white most of the time.  I cracked injector lines while turning it over to bleed the lines no real difference.  It was firing enough the exhaust manifold was warming up.  removed and drained the filter housing .  I can turn the flywheel by hand through the compression strokes easily.  As this little beast is supposed to have 355 lb compression I'm thinking the engine is pretty well toast.  I can't imagine being able to turn it by hand with anything close to the much compression.


Edited by Alberta Bolens, February 01, 2016 - 08:27 PM.


#6 ducky ONLINE  

ducky

    Senior Member

  • Senior Member
  • -GTt Supporter-
  • Contributor
  • Member No: 564
  • 1,623 Thanks
  • 3,860 posts
  • Location: Freedom, WI

Posted February 01, 2016 - 08:17 PM

yep I think you found your problem.



#7 JD318420 OFFLINE  

JD318420
  • Member
  • Member No: 79598
  • 34 Thanks
  • 63 posts
  • Location: Mid-Michigan

Posted February 01, 2016 - 09:12 PM

So Hook up a compression gauge an make sure. Then its up to you to decide if you want to rebuild it.



#8 Alberta Bolens OFFLINE  

Alberta Bolens
  • Senior Member
  • Member No: 49650
  • 442 Thanks
  • 251 posts
  • Location: Alberta Canada

Posted February 01, 2016 - 11:20 PM

So Hook up a compression gauge an make sure. Then its up to you to decide if you want to rebuild it.

I don't have a compression tester myself.  I'll have to see if I can borrow one from a buddy.  Better yet have him come do the compression test.   :smilewink: What are friends for.



#9 ol' stonebreaker ONLINE  

ol' stonebreaker
  • Senior Member
  • Member No: 12515
  • 1,304 Thanks
  • 973 posts
  • Location: idaho

Posted February 01, 2016 - 11:20 PM

  If it started easy when cold and now has blowby then something happened between the cold storage and the shop.

                                         Mike



#10 Alberta Bolens OFFLINE  

Alberta Bolens
  • Senior Member
  • Member No: 49650
  • 442 Thanks
  • 251 posts
  • Location: Alberta Canada

Posted February 01, 2016 - 11:28 PM

  If it started easy when cold and now has blowby then something happened between the cold storage and the shop.

                                         Mike

Its alway had blow by since I got it. I know the engine is tired. It was starting and running ok last fall.  It started decently when I brought it in and couple of times in the shop. When i tried yesterday and today it wouldn't run.  



#11 Tecumseh power ONLINE  

Tecumseh power

    Jack of all trades, master of none.

  • Senior Member
  • Member No: 77571
  • 941 Thanks
  • 766 posts
  • Location: Vintondale pa

Posted February 02, 2016 - 12:10 AM

What kind of work did you get done on it

#12 HANKG OFFLINE  

HANKG
  • Senior Member
  • Contributor
  • Member No: 29484
  • 4,877 Thanks
  • 2,791 posts
  • Location: Pt.Pleasant N.J.

Posted February 02, 2016 - 05:59 AM

No about 1/3 of tank.  Are you thinking condensation?

Indeed I was
  • Alberta Bolens said thank you

#13 JD318420 OFFLINE  

JD318420
  • Member
  • Member No: 79598
  • 34 Thanks
  • 63 posts
  • Location: Mid-Michigan

Posted February 02, 2016 - 07:31 PM

Just make sure you have hot brew and some human anti-freeze for your friend with the equipment to test the cylinder compression, I don't know if they do a leak down on diesel.


  • Alberta Bolens said thank you

#14 Alberta Bolens OFFLINE  

Alberta Bolens
  • Senior Member
  • Member No: 49650
  • 442 Thanks
  • 251 posts
  • Location: Alberta Canada

Posted April 03, 2016 - 10:59 PM

So I got back to getting the 455 started.  

 

I had changed a little fuel line that was dripping, of course got some air in the system.  reading the manual these engines are supposed to self bleed.  The darn thing would fire smoke but not catch and run.  So as I was trying to bleed the lines.  The starter crapped out on me.  It was weak to start with and being a little over zealous cranking I managed to finish it off.   :deadhorse:   being unemployed for the winter i didn't want ot spend big $$ on new or recon starter right away.  I also wanted it running so I wouldn't stress a new starter.  

 

New plan to get it going.  They use pup motors on cats right why not a JD 455.  I took the front clip hood etc off the tractor so I could get to the flywheel and built a pulley to bolt on and a braket to mount the mower engine on..

 Plan A use a 3 1/2 lawn mower engine. That failed.  No where near enough HP to turn the egine,with the oulleys I am using not enough reduction by far.

Plan B I happened to aquire a 5 1/2 hp Honda that should do.  NOT. It would almost turn the egine.

Plan C Out the log splitter it has a 14 hp kohler.  Pulled the JD out beside it. warmed up the kohler put the belt on started the kohler put some tension on the belt and  :dancingbanana: it turns it.  A bit of smoke and nothing but the engine is turning.  Then I thought :wallbanging: I should maybe turn the fuel on for the diesel tried it again and it fired up no problem.   :thumbs:.

 

Couple of photos of Plan C

 

 

This is n't a long term solution.  Now when I get a good starter I shouldn't be cranking it trying to get air out of the system. 

 

Post some photos once I get them out of the phone.  I'm being technacilly challanged tonight.

Attached Thumbnails

  • 20160204_142926.jpg
  • 20160403_094353.jpg
  • 20160204_142905.jpg
  • 20160204_143022.jpg

Edited by Alberta Bolens, April 05, 2016 - 07:56 PM.

  • Alc said thank you

#15 Alberta Bolens OFFLINE  

Alberta Bolens
  • Senior Member
  • Member No: 49650
  • 442 Thanks
  • 251 posts
  • Location: Alberta Canada

Posted April 23, 2016 - 06:56 PM

New starter arrived from ebay. :dancingbanana: $160 CDN delivered after shipping and customs took a week. John deere wanted $425 CDN  Jobber wanted $375 CDN.  I didn't mind waiting 10 days.

 

Put it on tractor starts fine.  I think the old starter was very tired and not turning fast enough.  I know the engine is a little tired too, so it takes little more cranking.  If I use it in the winter I will have to keep it in the garage.






Top