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Sears FF24 Igniton System Testing

no spark

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#1 Nascar3244888 OFFLINE  

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Posted March 03, 2015 - 01:20 PM

Hey guys I recently acquired a Sears FF24 at a local auction on the cheap.  It has a T260G Onan Twin in it. It needs quite a bit of TLC.  Which recently included me having to rewire the tractor.  Currently I have the tractor turning over with the key and am trying to get spark.  I have found a pdf that shows you how to check the igniton system. https://www.woodmize...85f0c63b17d.pdf After going through the pages and following the instructions, I have found that when I use a test light and check the negative side of the coil that my test light brightens and dims as I crank it over.  According to the pdf this should mean I need a new coil.  I was wondering if anyone else has used this type of method to determine why they had no spark and reached the same conclusion as the pdf is saying.  Basically what Im looking for is whether or not the pdf is correct or not before I go and buy a new coil.  Thanks!!

 


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#2 jms180 OFFLINE  

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Posted March 03, 2015 - 02:24 PM

Check the manual section there is a manual for the T260. Sorry I am not much help with the pdf posted. Old cowhand member is very knowledgeable with onan engines maybe he will chime in shortly.


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#3 KennyP ONLINE  

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Posted March 03, 2015 - 02:27 PM

Can't help you with that testing method. Did you rewire according to the FF 24 diagram?


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#4 jpd112294 OFFLINE  

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Posted March 03, 2015 - 07:03 PM

run a piece of wire from the + terminal on the battery to the hot side of the coil and see if you get any. ive done it plenty of times. maybe a bad ignition switch?



#5 olcowhand OFFLINE  

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Posted March 03, 2015 - 09:30 PM

Check the manual section there is a manual for the T260. Sorry I am not much help with the pdf posted. Old cowhand member is very knowledgeable with onan engines maybe he will chime in shortly.

 

Actually, I've never seen nor know anything about a t260.  But after looking it up, it has points ignition, so I would think the negative side of the coil should dim & brighten as points open & close.  But basically, if you have 12VDC to the coil, and you set the points to where the contacts are open, you should get spark from the coil when you ground & un-ground the coil side of the points with a screwdriver or similar.  Even with a bad condenser, you should get at least a weak spark doing this.  If not, replace the twin coil.


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#6 olcowhand OFFLINE  

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Posted March 03, 2015 - 09:37 PM

Hey guys I recently acquired a Sears FF24 at a local auction on the cheap.  It has a T260G Onan Twin in it. It needs quite a bit of TLC.  Which recently included me having to rewire the tractor.  Currently I have the tractor turning over with the key and am trying to get spark.  I have found a pdf that shows you how to check the igniton system. https://www.woodmize...85f0c63b17d.pdf After going through the pages and following the instructions, I have found that when I use a test light and check the negative side of the coil that my test light brightens and dims as I crank it over.  According to the pdf this should mean I need a new coil.  I was wondering if anyone else has used this type of method to determine why they had no spark and reached the same conclusion as the pdf is saying.  Basically what Im looking for is whether or not the pdf is correct or not before I go and buy a new coil.  Thanks!!

 

I just looked at the pdf you were going by.  It is confusing, as it shows a trigger module, like used on the P220 & others, yet the coil looks like the older type used on the contact point based ignitions.  To verify, does your engine have a points box on top rear of the block, behind the intake?


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#7 KennyP ONLINE  

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Posted March 04, 2015 - 06:47 AM

This part confuses me:

"With the test light grounded, move the test light to the negative terminal of the coil. Crank the engine. The test light should pulse bright and dim. If the light does not pulse, replace the module. If the light does pulse, replace the coil." I think this is only if you have no spark, maybe?

 

That makes no sense to me.

Daniel, pages 22 & 23 of the the T260 manual give test procedures for the module (if equipped) and the coil. I'm doing some more research.

 

Brad, try testing as the T260 manual says, especially the coil 'ohms' test. Remember, lots of folks are using a Harley Davidson coil on these and are supposed to be cheaper. I, too would like to know if it is points or a trigger module. There is a possibility it had an electronic coil on it like the P224 would have and someone switched it back to this coil thinking it was the correct one. I can get you a phone # for an Onan guru if you would like.


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#8 Nascar3244888 OFFLINE  

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Posted March 04, 2015 - 01:18 PM

I just looked at the pdf you were going by.  It is confusing, as it shows a trigger module, like used on the P220 & others, yet the coil looks like the older type used on the contact point based ignitions.  To verify, does your engine have a points box on top rear of the block, behind the intake?

 

Yes it has points, it doesnt have a module.  If I use a a test light on the negative side of the coil while trying to start it I get a dim and brighten pattern as the points open and close.  I have closely looked at the plugs for a spark and seen absolutely nothing.  I will check it out using the T260G manual directions, as well as by grounding the negative side of the coil with something with the points open and key in the run position and see what I get. Thanks



#9 Nascar3244888 OFFLINE  

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Posted March 04, 2015 - 01:44 PM

Ok, I went out and used page 23 to check the coil.  I had 3.9 primary resist.  and 13-14 secondary resist. which both falls in the good catagory.  So does this mean the coil is good?  Also the bracket that holds the coil to the intake manifold is broken....does the coil have to be grounded to the tractor through this bracket to work?  Also The one plug wire is missing the threaded piece that holds the wire onto the coil itself, someone had it electrical taped to the coil to keep it on the coil, would this cause the problem of no spark?? Also I tried hooking another coil up to it and dont get no spark from that one either, but that one is an unknown condition one that I had laying around.  


Edited by Nascar3244888, March 04, 2015 - 01:47 PM.


#10 KennyP ONLINE  

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Posted March 04, 2015 - 02:09 PM

If the coil tests good, it may be the condenser is bad. Have you cleaned the points contacts? I would use the T260 manual to make sure they are set correctly.

I think the original post here was for the electronic module test and not a points motor.



#11 Nascar3244888 OFFLINE  

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Posted March 04, 2015 - 02:15 PM

If the coil tests good, it may be the condenser is bad. Have you cleaned the points contacts? I would use the T260 manual to make sure they are set correctly.

I think the original post here was for the electronic module test and not a points motor.

 

Doesnt the dimming and brightening of the test light at the coil show the condensor is good? Also the points are clean



#12 KennyP ONLINE  

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Posted March 04, 2015 - 03:21 PM

Are the points sparking?



#13 Nascar3244888 OFFLINE  

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Posted March 04, 2015 - 05:05 PM

Are the points sparking?

 

I didnt see anything: fried points?? I found a set of points with a new condenser on ebay for 23.95 + free ship.  At this point according to the tests the coil should be fine so as long as I have power at the coil...which I do....what else is there really besides replacing the points and condenser?? Also I checked resist in the plug wires and both are between 1.9-2.1


Edited by Nascar3244888, March 04, 2015 - 05:18 PM.


#14 KennyP ONLINE  

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Posted March 04, 2015 - 05:38 PM

It may be the condenser or the wire to the points is shorting out somewhere. Can you get it dark where the tractor is? Maybe you can see a spark jumping where it shouldn't?



#15 Nascar3244888 OFFLINE  

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Posted March 12, 2015 - 05:44 PM

Got the Tractor Going today!! I installed a new set of points along with a new condenser.  My excitement was quickly overtaken by anxiety though.  I found that the engine leaks oil pretty bad.  One place it was leaking was at the pto end of the engine where it appears a thick plate bolts on, which looks like the crank bearing my be in?.  I found that the nuts holding that on were loose so i tightened them which got that down to a minimal leak.  Then I found the oil filter was loose so I tightened that up.  Now I have a leak coming from the area behind the flywheel so unfortunately that requires engine removal.  Also I found out the tractor does drive, but unfortunately the atf started spewing out of a broke hydraulic line by the hydraulic cylinder.  That line broke the fitting off flush with the cylinder so I have no idea how to fix that.  Plus to top it off, literally, the fill hose for the transmission is cracked at several spots and atf cannot be added.....so how was everyone elses day lol.  Engine doesn't smoke much if any at all.


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