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Going to look a a JD model B, questions.


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#1 BillTheTractorMan OFFLINE  

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Posted February 12, 2015 - 05:26 PM

I'm going to look at a model B John Deere.

Has not ran in 8yrs I'm told, guy had a different tractor that he preceded and when the battery died he gave upon this one.

It has a loader.
It's possibly a 1950.
Is electric start.

That's all I know until I look at it in person.

What should I be looking for?
can I roll the engine over by hand with out removing guards or should I try to boost it with my truck? I'm concerned if its 6volt that I may damage the ignition system with the 12volt boost.

I looked and seen aftermarket 3pt hitches available, were original hitches available from the factory. I want something that looks good.

Lack of live pro and hydraulics doesn't bother me. I also plan in ditching the loader right away.

I would like to use this tractor for grading, running a finish mower(3pt), and other basic duties at a non-profit that I help out. I'm currently using garden tractors and they are just undersized. Another guy uses a farmall M but I think that's a bit overkill for pulling a 6ft finish mower and a 5ft blade.
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#2 CRFarnsworth ONLINE  

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Posted February 12, 2015 - 05:39 PM

I had been advised by the "old guy" at the local electric automotive shop ..... the 6 volt starter would stand up to a 12 volt system but not to crank it for very long.  If it doesn't start right off do not keep cranking for an extended period.

 

I had a 48 chevy with a 216 engine. I converted the car to 12 volt with an HEI distributor. I continued to use the original 6 volt starter for about a year.   But the engine usually fired right off.    

 

It can be done. Just don't stay in it for a long time.     Rick


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#3 BillTheTractorMan OFFLINE  

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Posted February 12, 2015 - 06:08 PM

I had been advised by the "old guy" at the local electric automotive shop ..... the 6 volt starter would stand up to a 12 volt system but not to crank it for very long. If it doesn't start right off do not keep cranking for an extended period.

I had a 48 chevy with a 216 engine. I converted the car to 12 volt with an HEI distributor. I continued to use the original 6 volt starter for about a year. But the engine usually fired right off.

It can be done. Just don't stay in it for a long time. Rick

I knew that, all I want to know is if its rolling over freely or rusted up.

Will the quick 12v jolt kill the coil or other ignition parts?

#4 glgrumpy ONLINE  

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Posted February 12, 2015 - 06:18 PM

ON old chevy's was told the 6 volt actually has bigger wires and is like a HD 12 volt then.  I have converted these trucks to 12 and ran for years, no problems. Problem is in running the lights and other items at the 12 that is issue. The coils will still be 6-volt and resistors in light and ignition swithes and such. I don't know if B's are that new?? 50?  I also don't think they would have had a 3-pt unless someone added on an aftermarket one?  Could be wrong on that. The older rigs had big flywheel on side to turn and start, but maybe with electric it is just a big metal cover over that area then?  Hope it is inside?  With those top mounted carbs and no cleaner attached say and exhaust open to weather, might be water in it and froze for sure if outside?  Just look at overall appearance, and trying things to see if work. Items like lights, knobs, spark plug covers and wire covers and seat and such can all be added if needed later easily and little cost. Big items like carbs and radiators and tires can add up quick. Lots of used parts at shows, but some bring bigger money, just because it is Green.  Many older tractors are not the useful w/out the 3pts and that is why they don't get used much anymore, cept maybe to pull hay wagons and such. You might consider a little newer tractor, maybbe even diff brand to get the 3pt and better features.  The old Ford N series are still the handiest size and have 3 pts and sell cheap in most markets.  Some Olivers like 55's are also good size and not too expensive.

   One question:  Are you the same fella that was on the Moline lists and had a MM R?? What happen to that if so?  I realize it does not have the 3pt, but should be good size if you have pull implements.



#5 IHCubGuy ONLINE  

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Posted February 12, 2015 - 06:18 PM

I knew that, all I want to know is if its rolling over freely or rusted up.

Will the quick 12v jolt kill the coil or other ignition parts?

That will depend on whether it has a magneto on it or a distributor.  If it has a distributor just unhook the plug wires on it, BUT make sure you keep note which is which.  As for rolling it by hand if its a 1950 then it is a pressed frame and the whole flywheel is enclosed.  I would take the plugs out to if it was me before you put battery power to it in case it has any type of fluid laying in the cylinders.  You don't want a hydraulic lock on your hands that could damage internal engine components.  As for the 12 volts to the starter, no worries there.  We have a 44 A that we restored and we converted it to a 12 volt generator and the starter handles it just fine and has since 2001.  We have a Farmall H that has been on 12 volts for 30+ years and it has never given any problems.  Good luck.

 

On the 3 point, model A's and B's could be equipped with the model 800 factory 3 point but they are EXTREMELY expensive to purchase IF you can find one.  Allthough they did not reccomend them for the B.  All A's and B's did have a rockshaft on them though that you could put an aftermarket 3 point on.  They were not "live" though.  If you can fine one there was also a hydraulic pump that you could get that went between the governor and the magneto or distributor. (whichever it had)


Edited by IHCubGuy, February 12, 2015 - 06:37 PM.


#6 Leonard VanCamp OFFLINE  

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Posted February 12, 2015 - 06:34 PM

I'm not sure about a three point on a B. I know that the 50, 520 and 530 which were based off the B have three point capabilities. Like glgrumpy said, a old Ford N series or a Oliver 55 would be better for what your planned uses are. A couple of others would a IH utility like a 340, John Deere 420, 430, 435 or anything in that size, maybe even a old John Deere M.


Edited by Leonard VanCamp, February 12, 2015 - 06:34 PM.


#7 BillTheTractorMan OFFLINE  

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Posted February 12, 2015 - 06:38 PM

I'm not a fan of the ford tractors, just a preference.

I like Oliver's but the price tags are out of my spending limit.

This happens to owned by a neighbor that plans on moving and just wants it gone from the impression I'm getting.

If it has a magneto how can I protect that from the jolt?

#8 IHCubGuy ONLINE  

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Posted February 12, 2015 - 07:17 PM

If it has a magneto how can I protect that from the jolt?

 

A magneto has nothing to do with the starting system.  They are a stand alone unit completely seperate.  Nothing to worry about.  If it is a distributor ignition it will be round and look like this:

 

b dist.jpg

 

If it is a magneto ignition it will look something like this and usualy says Wico on the cap:

b mag.jpg


Edited by IHCubGuy, February 12, 2015 - 07:18 PM.


#9 BillTheTractorMan OFFLINE  

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Posted February 12, 2015 - 07:20 PM

A magneto has nothing to do with the starting system. They are a stand alone unit completely seperate. Nothing to worry about. If it is a distributor ignition it will be round and look like this:

attachicon.gifb dist.jpg

If it is a magneto ignition it will look something like this and usualy says Wico on the cap:
attachicon.gifb mag.jpg

When I turn the key won't it energize the ignition system? Or is the switch separate on these?

I would jump right to the started but I read that it is mounted under the engine and may be difficult to get at.

#10 BillTheTractorMan OFFLINE  

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Posted February 12, 2015 - 07:22 PM

ON old chevy's was told the 6 volt actually has bigger wires and is like a HD 12 volt then. I have converted these trucks to 12 and ran for years, no problems. Problem is in running the lights and other items at the 12 that is issue. The coils will still be 6-volt and resistors in light and ignition swithes and such. I don't know if B's are that new?? 50? I also don't think they would have had a 3-pt unless someone added on an aftermarket one? Could be wrong on that. The older rigs had big flywheel on side to turn and start, but maybe with electric it is just a big metal cover over that area then? Hope it is inside? With those top mounted carbs and no cleaner attached say and exhaust open to weather, might be water in it and froze for sure if outside? Just look at overall appearance, and trying things to see if work. Items like lights, knobs, spark plug covers and wire covers and seat and such can all be added if needed later easily and little cost. Big items like carbs and radiators and tires can add up quick. Lots of used parts at shows, but some bring bigger money, just because it is Green. Many older tractors are not the useful w/out the 3pts and that is why they don't get used much anymore, cept maybe to pull hay wagons and such. You might consider a little newer tractor, maybbe even diff brand to get the 3pt and better features. The old Ford N series are still the handiest size and have 3 pts and sell cheap in most markets. Some Olivers like 55's are also good size and not too expensive.
One question: Are you the same fella that was on the Moline lists and had a MM R?? What happen to that if so? I realize it does not have the 3pt, but should be good size if you have pull implements.

The MM R belongs to my grandfather. After last year using our Oliver 770 there he decided to discontinue that. Too much hassle.

Plus the john Deere is a would be a little more showy for parades and tractor shows. Kids recognize the sound and get excited. I also volunteer and am on the board of directors for a local heritage festival.

#11 IHCubGuy ONLINE  

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Posted February 12, 2015 - 07:51 PM

When I turn the key won't it energize the ignition system? Or is the switch separate on these?

I would jump right to the started but I read that it is mounted under the engine and may be difficult to get at.

Not on a magneto ignition.  The switch if there is one on a magneto system only grounds out the magneto.  It does nothing to energize it.  I would bet that it is a late model pressed frame tractor and yes the starter is buried inside of the flywheel shroud on these.  I am not sure how hard it is to get at the terminal on it.  I would just hook it up like you would any other battery you would jump.



#12 propane1 ONLINE  

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Posted February 12, 2015 - 09:36 PM

Cockshutt 30 tractor had live pto and maybe 3 point hitch. You would want to look for some thing a little newer, around late 50's early 60's, by then 3 point hitch was mostly standard and live pto power was more common. I understand your reasoning about the John Deere B. But maybe more work to get rigged up than buying something else. The John Deere and farmalls had an optional 2 point hitch system that maybe be converted to 3 point. Just some thoughts, Noel

#13 nbent OFFLINE  

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Posted February 12, 2015 - 09:38 PM

If it is a 50 there is a cover on the bottom of the engine held on by 4 bolts either 7/16 or 1/2 I can't remember and you can get to the starter and take off the power wires off and put jumper cables on or I would take 2 cables and a battery and use one of the cover bolts for the ground

#14 BillTheTractorMan OFFLINE  

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Posted February 17, 2015 - 07:20 PM

Here it is. When the cold and wind subsides I will try to drag it home.

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#15 BillTheTractorMan OFFLINE  

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Posted February 20, 2015 - 07:07 PM

Well, no luck. It's not moving. We couldn't spin the fan. Brake drums wiggled but we couldn't get the rear wheels to turn, only a wiggle. Radiator is empty and very rusty. I'm getting pretty disappointed. Maybe $800 was too much. Probably was my luck...

The only victory so far is we moved it 6inches with our Oliver by dragging it.




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