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Fixing/cleaning tr10d engine


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#16 dlang94 OFFLINE  

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Posted December 28, 2014 - 09:35 PM

I got the rest taken apart I need new piston rings and and a connecting rod. The piston measures 3.105" and the cylinder measures 3.125". The cylinder measures even and feels smooth, should I hone it or leave it as is? Are those marks on the inside of the crankshaft normal? ImageUploadedByTapatalk1419820464.591488.jpg ImageUploadedByTapatalk1419820472.571072.jpg ImageUploadedByTapatalk1419820478.354583.jpg ImageUploadedByTapatalk1419820485.272643.jpg ImageUploadedByTapatalk1419820490.706411.jpg ImageUploadedByTapatalk1419820498.022769.jpg

Edited by dlang94, December 28, 2014 - 11:23 PM.

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#17 Texas Deere and Horse OFFLINE  

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Posted December 28, 2014 - 10:54 PM

If the Crank has Aluminum on it, you can clean it off with Muriatic acid. It will take the Aluminum off and not hurt the steel crank. Once you get it all cleaned up, you can mic it to see if it's out of round.


That is Aluminum build up on the crank journal, clean it described above.

The blueing in the counter weights is from grinding them to balance the crankshaft and got it hot enough to blue the metal, won't hurt anything.
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#18 DougT ONLINE  

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Posted December 29, 2014 - 02:04 AM

 

I got the rest taken apart I need new piston rings and and a connecting rod. The piston measures 3.105" and the cylinder measures 3.125". The cylinder measures even and feels smooth, should I hone it or leave it as is? Are those marks on the inside of the crankshaft normal?

You say the cylinder measures 3.125 from top to bottom and 90* apart from each other? Where did you measure the piston? Down on the skirt or up by the ring lands? You are showing 20 thou clearance in your measurements.Too much if you have measured right.



#19 dlang94 OFFLINE  

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Posted December 29, 2014 - 07:09 AM

I measured how wide the cylinder is and how wide the piston is. I measured the piston at the ring lands.

#20 DougT ONLINE  

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Posted December 29, 2014 - 08:15 AM

The piston should be measured more at the skirt. It will be bigger than the ring lands. The cylinder should be measured at 3 or 4 points down the bore. Start about 1/4 to 1/2 inch down for a true reading. After you have taken those measurements, turn the mic or snap guage 90* and check about the same spots again. This will give you out of round and taper of the bore. If you are just checking the top with a caliper, you're not getting a true measurement.



#21 dlang94 OFFLINE  

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Posted December 29, 2014 - 11:17 AM

I measured the cylinder from a good amount of different places I used a telescoping gauge and a digital caliper, it isn't out of round. The specifications are saying the cylinder bore should be, 3.1255 - 3.1245.  I did do the piston again closer to the bottom comes out as 3.11", but I didn't measure inside of where the rings sit the first time either. 

 

I'm going to pick up some Muriatic acid today to to clean the aluminum off.

 

These rings seem to be what I am looking for, http://www.ebay.com/...STRK:MEBIDX:IT 

 

From what I have found I should replace the connecting rod with a DA83AS10?



#22 Bolens 1000 ONLINE  

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Posted December 29, 2014 - 12:54 PM

I measured the cylinder from a good amount of different places I used a telescoping gauge and a digital caliper, it isn't out of round. The specifications are saying the cylinder bore should be, 3.1255 - 3.1245.  I did do the piston again closer to the bottom comes out as 3.11", but I didn't measure inside of where the rings sit the first time either. 

 

I'm going to pick up some Muriatic acid today to to clean the aluminum off.

 

These rings seem to be what I am looking for, http://www.ebay.com/...STRK:MEBIDX:IT 

 

From what I have found I should replace the connecting rod with a DA83AS10?

 

Your engine is bored half over.. You can still get away with a fresh set of standard size rings if your bore is in good shape which it appears to be from your measurements.

Those ring's in the link are the Tri-Chrome sets but in oversize which your engine is not.

You will need standard size rings or 0.010 oversize and file them down if need be.

Same goes for the Rod, the one you describe is undersize and should still be standard. DA-83A-S1

 

I do stock most of these parts but there is a killer deal on ebay right now for the Rod

http://www.ebay.com/...=item51a7a80818


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#23 dlang94 OFFLINE  

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Posted December 29, 2014 - 04:35 PM

The bore size thing kind of confuses me but I'm getting it slowly. I'm going to send you a message about the rings, bolens 1000. Thanks for the other info I saw that rod just didn't know which one I should be looking at.

#24 Bolens 1000 ONLINE  

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Posted December 29, 2014 - 04:37 PM

Is it the 1/2 over your confused about?

 

Not a problem, glad I could pass on the info, although the TR/TRA series look the same the stroke on the TRA is a bit longer thus requiring a different rod. With wisconsin parts being on the high side its better safe than sorry to ask  questions!



#25 DougT ONLINE  

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Posted December 29, 2014 - 08:36 PM

I measured the cylinder from a good amount of different places I used a telescoping gauge and a digital caliper, it isn't out of round. The specifications are saying the cylinder bore should be, 3.1255 - 3.1245.  I did do the piston again closer to the bottom comes out as 3.11", but I didn't measure inside of where the rings sit the first time either. 

 

I'm going to pick up some Muriatic acid today to to clean the aluminum off.

 

Is there a spec listing for piston to bore clearance? You're still showing 13 thou. I would expect the spec to be in the 3-4 thou range. It will probably run like that but I think I would consider a new piston too, especially for a working engine. You might find a piston and ring set for not a whole lot more. Another test I do is put the piston in the bore without rings and feel for slop. If you can get a clunk back and forth, its too loose.

 

It would be a wise idea to get the crank cleaned up and mic'ed before you order the rod too.



#26 Bolens 1000 ONLINE  

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Posted December 29, 2014 - 08:45 PM

Is there a spec listing for piston to bore clearance? You're still showing 13 thou. I would expect the spec to be in the 3-4 thou range. It will probably run like that but I think I would consider a new piston too, especially for a working engine. You might find a piston and ring set for not a whole lot more. Another test I do is put the piston in the bore without rings and feel for slop. If you can get a clunk back and forth, its too loose.

 

It would be a wise idea to get the crank cleaned up and mic'ed before you order the rod too.

 

He's going to need to bore out the block if he gets a new piston though, the 1/2 over pistons were not available service parts once they left the factory.



#27 DougT ONLINE  

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Posted December 29, 2014 - 09:35 PM

He's going to need to bore out the block if he gets a new piston though, the 1/2 over pistons were not available service parts once they left the factory.

The half over piston was just half a thou, right? Even a standard piston is going to get him a lot closer than he is now. What does a standard piston mic at?


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#28 Bolens 1000 ONLINE  

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Posted December 29, 2014 - 10:42 PM

I believe these were 5 thousandths over....


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#29 Texas Deere and Horse OFFLINE  

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Posted December 29, 2014 - 10:51 PM

The half over piston was just half a thou, right? Even a standard piston is going to get him a lot closer than he is now. What does a standard piston mic at?

 

I believe these were 5 thousandths over....

 

Doug, Doc is correct. The factory bored these blocks .005" over to clean up the bore and had special .005" pistons produced to save the block from leaving the factory as a .010" over "NEW" engine..


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#30 DougT ONLINE  

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Posted December 29, 2014 - 11:33 PM

Doug, Doc is correct. The factory bored these blocks .005" over to clean up the bore and had special .005" pistons produced to save the block from leaving the factory as a .010" over "NEW" engine..

 I'm not sure I buy that answer. "quote specifications are saying the cylinder bore should be, 3.1255 - 3.1245" I looked this up and and I came up with the same thing dlang did. Not sure why Wisconsin would list the bigger number first but that's the way its listed.  If Wisconsin bored it .005 over to begin with this engine should have left the factory with a bore of 3.1295-3.1305. He is getting a reading of 3.125 which is middle of the spec. I've never seen a bore shrink. Wisconsin calls for a piston to bore clearance of .004-.0045. I couldn't find a spec on standard piston measurements but if you had a block with the bore on the top end of spec a piston that was .0005 (half a thou) over would bring the clearance back in spec. Doc, do you have any documentation from Wisconsin on this? I haven't been able to find any.


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