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# Mid size trucks

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### #16 dodge trucker OFFLINE

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Posted December 16, 2014 - 10:27 PM

Dakotas have been good to me. I refuse to buy anything "but" an American brand, and I refuse to buy new.

I can buy at least 6-8 good used ones for less than the cost of a single new one no matter the brand. and as in the case of my current Dakota;  still driving it 46K later, with no plans to get rid of any time soon; hopefully I can get another 40-50K from it (currently at 176K miles on the odo)

Even at $3500/ea, average, if I can get 50K a piece (average) out of a used truck, most more than that, add up the cost years of service and total miles of them all and there is NO brand new anything that I can buy, that will outlast that total, by itself....(I usually pay alot less for my daily drivers!) just used that as a figure for conversation's sake. if I change to another "class" of truck it will be back to a full size, I seem to go back n forth. All else being equal (year model engine options miles and condition) other than one's an auto and the other's a stick, I won't even flinch; I'll buy the truck with a stick, every time. Edited by dodge trucker, December 16, 2014 - 10:28 PM. • Alc and hamman have said thanks ### #17 richwoodrocket OFFLINE richwoodrocket 16 year old JD lover • Senior Member • Contributor • Member No: 57205 • 147 Thanks • 177 posts • Location: Hamburg, NY Posted December 16, 2014 - 11:22 PM Interesting concept. I am surprised that ford doesn't have an ecoboost diesel option in the new f150. It seems like small displacement diesels are the future. Now if ford made a diesel f150 raptor, that would be my dream vehicle... One can only hope... • hamman said thank you ### #18 petrj6 OFFLINE petrj6 • Senior Member • -GTt Supporter- • Contributor • Member No: 53717 • 3,700 Thanks • 2,158 posts • Location: petersbrgh ny Posted December 17, 2014 - 05:51 AM superaben I have to point out a small fact, ford was the only American manufacturer that did not get a bail out because their parts department was and still is doing such a banner business !!!!!! and that is a fact. my wife is a parts manager at a ford dealership. I don't understand why fords are the way they are, I had fords for many years and loved them then got my first chevy and never looked back, the new fords aren't worth a dime. Pete • hamman said thank you ### #19 Alc OFFLINE Alc Tractorholic • Senior Member • -GTt Supporter- • Contributor • Member No: 1094 • 5,278 Thanks • 6,482 posts • Location: Bangor Pa Posted December 17, 2014 - 06:20 AM Now since it's just my wife the dog and myself a small or midsize truck would be fine for us to have . We would still need the fullsize for the 29' camper ( yea I know people tow stuff that big with smaller trucks but not this fellow anyway ) But like outers have said it needs to get better fuel mileage and cost enough less that a full size to warrant it. • hamman said thank you ### #20 CRFarnsworth OFFLINE CRFarnsworth Member • Senior Member • Contributor • Member No: 6275 • 3,590 Thanks • 1,717 posts • Location: Rossville Illinois Posted December 17, 2014 - 07:05 AM superaben I have to point out a small fact, ford was the only American manufacturer that did not get a bail out because their parts department was and still is doing such a banner business !!!!!! and that is a fact. my wife is a parts manager at a ford dealership. I work at a parts depot for a large company. We always make them a major profit , especially in "bad times". I remember reading a quote from Henry Ford during the early years, That he would give away the car if he was garaunteed to sell the replacement parts. Our companys profit margin is based more on "parts" than it is on unit sales. That said i would love to have a new truck. I just don't want to pay for it, regardless of brand. Rick • Alc and hamman have said thanks ### #21 toppop52 OFFLINE toppop52 • Senior Member • Member No: 54420 • 3,212 Thanks • 3,198 posts • Location: Lower Eastern Shore of Maryland Posted December 17, 2014 - 07:34 AM I find it funny, the comments on the new Colorado, best mid sized truck built to date, period. Not much cheaper than full sized, but no mid size is. I dont own one, nor will I likely, doesn't change the facts. • hamman said thank you ### #22 TAHOE OFFLINE TAHOE • Senior Member • -GTt Supporter- • Contributor • Member No: 24522 • 6,415 Thanks • 4,880 posts • Location: "Hamiltucky" Ohio Posted December 17, 2014 - 08:09 AM New Colorado is Truck of the year and has all that here now. A little Diesel is coming later if you like those. Not sure that will "Pull like a train" as noted in the Ford ad! When did Ford start advertizing for GM? I was at the gas station the other day and saw a Jeep Liberty with a diesel in it. Never knew that. Yuup, the Liberty deisel also had a tow rating of 7000#s, no freaking way I would put that much behind one of those. I have pulled about 3000#'s -16' trailer with our gas and it was almost scary behind that short light vehicle. The deisel was made by Venturi motors out of Italy, 2.8L 4 cyl. It was a decent motor after you tuned it, EGR delete, etc. They had a lot of problems though, many guys were dropping turbos and valve trains. One guy waited a whole year and spent$8500 for a brand new motor to be shipped from Italy.....that Libby would have went to the junk yard had it been mine. They also had bad tranny shutter when shifting, wrong convertor design/rpm range from factory couple with the deisel made for a shakey experience.

I had an '93 S10 and a 96 Ranger, I would take the S10 over the ranger any day. More power, better gas mileage and well it just looked better.

The new Colordao---yuck, I guess it's the new age designs, but I prefer my 73-87 box Chevys!

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### #23 IHCubGuy OFFLINE

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Posted December 17, 2014 - 04:41 PM

Good luck getting a manual tranny in a truck you want to do towing.  Township I work at bought a new F550 this spring.  Ford ONLY builds them in automatic.  You can get a Ram 5500 in manual but if you read the fine print in the sales literature the tow rating on them is lower than an automatic and they are NOT recommended to be used with a plow.

As for Rangers, mom and dad had a 2003 with a 4.0 V6 and a 4 speed automatic.  That thing got 11 mpg TOPS!  Never better than that.  The seats were horribly uncomfortable and the suspension was so hard it rode worse than a horse drawn carriage.  They traded it in 2005 for a new 2500HD Chevy with a Duramax.  That truck rides much smoother than the Ranger did and it gets 17mpg towing a trailer with a skid steer on it.  127000 miles later mom and dad bought a new one and I now have the 05.  Highway running without a trailerl I can get 24 mpg with it.  When you can get that kind of mileage and versatility it makes a small truck pretty pointless.

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### #24 glgrumpy OFFLINE

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Posted December 17, 2014 - 05:41 PM

On pulling up and leaving, that is Industrial way!  They build place to match market for the moment, when it's done selling or not wanted as much, out they go!  I worked at a Dana plant in late 70's did that to me. GM's full of empty plants or sites now in INdiana that made items now outsourced, many to foreign makers. Just heard in flyer at work that "GM is spending many Billions to DOUBLE there Mexican output of engines, trans, and vehicles for their Truck Market! Talking about Billion for Ft.Wayne future too, but not really saying what it might be as of this time, but sure won't be that much of change I bet!  Crew Cab trucks are the biggest seller and we cannot build them there, too  small of turns and such in lines for the length. We all hope that maybe that problem will be corrected some day. AND, our paint shop is becoming out-dated, that is where we believe the re-fresh is going to be for now.

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### #25 dodge trucker OFFLINE

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Posted December 17, 2014 - 06:41 PM

I work at a parts depot for a large company.  We always make them a major profit , especially in "bad times".

I remember reading  a quote from Henry Ford during the early years, That he would give away the car if he was garaunteed to sell the replacement parts.  Our companys profit margin is based more on "parts" than it is on unit sales.

That said  i would love to have a new truck.  I just don't want to pay for it, regardless of brand.      Rick

yeah and its funny how the price of parts has exploded for cars for tractors for anything.... (and not funny in a good way either)

### #26 dodge trucker OFFLINE

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Posted December 17, 2014 - 06:54 PM

The new Colordao---yuck, I guess it's the new age designs, but I prefer my 73-87 box Chevys!

How did that line not come up as a quote? I quoted the post that line was from and deleted "most" of the rest

yeah if I were to buy a Chevy that would n\be the newest I would want... 67-62s better and 62-66s were better yet

I wish I knew just when the auto trans passed up the stick for towing capacity... I just like driving the stick better except in bumper to bumper Chicago traffic which I am in MAYBE twice a year... I live in the sticks and I would rather drive a stick.

for 4 doors, yeah if you have a bunch of kids or a construction crew, I can see a need. Neither applies to me and I just do not like the looks of many vehicles that have 4 doors.  I have taken a liking to a club cab (extended 2 door) but have never liked a crew cab; Couple that these days with beds that are 5' long and to me that equals a useless "truck".

I have my eye on a 1st gen Cummins truck that has a good body except for peeling paint. The guy knows I am interested, just waiting for him to give me the word...

reg cab 8' bed and 3/4 ton. Perfect.  Add in the cost of paint and a little elbow grease, and who needs to spend upwards of \$50K on a full size truck?  My boss just paid very nearly that for a gas, Silverado Denali 1/2 ton with one of those extra short useless beds and too many doors (he doesnt even have  kids, just him and his wife)  but I doubt I'll ever see much more than maybe some groceries in that bed..... he really does not even need a truck at all

IH Cub Guy/ 11 MPG from a Ford 4.0? I have never seen one that bad. My neighbor gets over 20 from his 95 4WD with around 300K miles on it....

but regarding my current Dakota, (93 club cab 318 V8 that I converted to a stick, with parts from a wreck) I am surprised at its mileage, which is as good on a "bad" day as my last Dakota got on a "good" day  (94 reg cab shortbed 3.9 V6/auto) This time a year back n forth to work and back is about 17-1/2 MPG/  summer, same driving conditions gets me 19, solid straight highway driving and it's over 20

I could give up a little bit in the MPG department seeing as though I do not have car payments/

Edited by dodge trucker, December 17, 2014 - 07:05 PM.

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### #27 toomanytoys84 OFFLINE

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Posted December 17, 2014 - 07:18 PM

Good luck getting a manual tranny in a truck you want to do towing. Township I work at bought a new F550 this spring. Ford ONLY builds them in automatic. You can get a Ram 5500 in manual but if you read the fine print in the sales literature the tow rating on them is lower than an automatic and they are NOT recommended to be used with a plow.

As for Rangers, mom and dad had a 2003 with a 4.0 V6 and a 4 speed automatic. That thing got 11 mpg TOPS! Never better than that. The seats were horribly uncomfortable and the suspension was so hard it rode worse than a horse drawn carriage. They traded it in 2005 for a new 2500HD Chevy with a Duramax. That truck rides much smoother than the Ranger did and it gets 17mpg towing a trailer with a skid steer on it. 127000 miles later mom and dad bought a new one and I now have the 05. Highway running without a trailerl I can get 24 mpg with it. When you can get that kind of mileage and versatility it makes a small truck pretty pointless.

Something was seriously wrong with that ranger. Most people easily average 18 plus with the 4.0 and 20 plus with the 3.0.

that was always my personal experience with them.
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### #28 IHCubGuy OFFLINE

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Posted December 17, 2014 - 08:05 PM

IH Cub Guy/ 11 MPG from a Ford 4.0? I have never seen one that bad. My neighbor gets over 20 from his 95 4WD with around 300K miles on it....

Something was seriously wrong with that ranger. Most people easily average 18 plus with the 4.0 and 20 plus with the 3.0.

that was always my personal experience with them.

That's an honest to goodness number.  If I was a betting man though I would say it was the gearing.  And the fact that it was a Level 2 FX4 and it had factory 31x10.50-15 tires on it probably didn't help it either, (mileage and ride).  Truck before it was a 92 S10 that they bought new, extended cab 4wd with a 4.3 and a 4 speed automatic.  They used that truck like a half ton and it never let them down.

And I am not just some Ford bashing guy either.  Up until 3 years ago all the vehicles I've owned were Ford's.  I'd love to have my 89 Bronco II back.  That thing would go almost anywhere, it had the perfect mix of power and gearing.  Compared to the wifes Liberty it was a tank!

Edited by IHCubGuy, December 17, 2014 - 08:10 PM.

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Posted December 17, 2014 - 08:37 PM

My current truck is a 99 dodge 2500 4X4, great on power, not so much on gas, but can't afford a second vehicle at the moment.  Did anyone know that when ford first came out with the Ranger, they did offer a 4cyl diesel? Chevy offered a diesel in the LUV, and Mazda and Izuzu offered diesel "small" trucks as well.  I would love to find an early to mid 80's Ford ranger to play with.

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### #30 Leonard VanCamp OFFLINE

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Posted December 17, 2014 - 09:15 PM

If you tried hard enough you could find diesels in small trucks, Toyota had a diesel option in the Hilux (pre Tacoma), only thing was it wasn't available in the U.S. If you look close Ford and Mazda have a partnership with their small trucks, they are basically the same with different engines and badges, Chevy and Isuzu did the same thing with the early S-10's/ Hombre's.

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