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1963 Cub Cadet Original Governor Trouble


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#1 Spaceboy5 OFFLINE  

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Posted October 16, 2014 - 06:19 PM

     Hello various GT-Talk members! I am new to the site, but have used it's forums before to help me out with other problems. I've visited so much, I decided to go ahead and make an account.

     This may be my most challenging problem yet. I have a '63 Cub Cadet Original with a Kohler K161 engine on it. I recently got it running after it sat outside for about 15 years. Upon its first start, it happily sprang to life with no misses or backfires, at idle, without the need of choke. I soon found out that it wouldn't run wide open. I checked my throttle connections, and couldn't find anything wrong with it. So I investigated further and found out that when no running, the throttle brings the carburetor to wide open, and has full range of motion, but when the machine is running, the throttle can barely raise up to half. The carburetor can be manually pushed to wide open, and it runs well at that speed, but the throttle can't seem to bring it there on its own. I figure that it must be a governor problem. So I took the governor arm off, cleaned all the moving parts, and reset the governor arm, but it changed nothing. The K161 has an internal governor. No governor spring visible or anything. The throttle cable runs directly to a disc that pulls on the governor arm, which is connected with a little rod directly to the carburetor. I don't know how the internal governor works, but the engine is 51 years old, so it can't be too complicated. It has to be the governor because the throttle has full range of motion when the engine is not running, and the governor obviously isn't working when the engine isn't running. And as I said before, when the engine is running, the throttle on the carburetor visibly cannot move any more than half way to its max, with the throttle lever at full. I'm stumped. If anyone has experienced or heard of anything like this, any information at this point would be helpful. Thanks in advance!



#2 KennyP ONLINE  

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Posted October 16, 2014 - 06:47 PM

You might want to check your throttle lever cable. It may be set to not allow it to reach wide open!


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#3 Auburn David OFFLINE  

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Posted October 16, 2014 - 07:22 PM

"So I investigated further and found out that when no running, the throttle brings the carburetor to wide open, and has full range of motion"

 

That is correct and should happen.I agree with the post above.


Edited by Auburn, October 16, 2014 - 07:22 PM.


#4 superaben OFFLINE  

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Posted October 16, 2014 - 08:58 PM

Welcome to the forum.  After lurking around for so long, I'm glad you decided to join up and be sociable.  :smilewink: :wave:  Sounds like you have a nice herd already.  You ought to tell us about them, but most importantly, show them off a bit.  We like to swoon over tractors around here.

 

First off, a K161 does have a governor spring.  It is on the shaft and ties into that circular disc that your throttle cable ties into.  I'd make sure that spring is in place, not broken, and doing its job. 

 

Make sure your throttle cable is in the right hole and (like Kenny said) set right.

 

Ben W.


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#5 Spaceboy5 OFFLINE  

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Posted October 17, 2014 - 06:45 PM

     Thanks for the great ideas guys. I took a few more looks, but nothing you've suggested I haven't already tried or heard unfortunately. I'm thinking it might be something within the internal governor, since the throttle works fine without the engine running. The only other thing in effect when the engine is running is the governor. So something about it isn't letting the engine rev as high as it should. All of the linkages look fine, and I cleaned everything up about it, and the only thing I haven't done is look inside at the internal part of the governor. I can't find any record of someone else having the same problem anywhere online. It's a real head-scratcher. Hmm...



#6 Auburn David OFFLINE  

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Posted October 17, 2014 - 06:49 PM

If you remove the throttle cable can you high rev it by hand with it running?



#7 Spaceboy5 OFFLINE  

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Posted October 17, 2014 - 06:49 PM

Yes



#8 Auburn David OFFLINE  

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Posted October 17, 2014 - 06:58 PM

Yes

And it goes full throttle?



#9 Auburn David OFFLINE  

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Posted October 17, 2014 - 07:05 PM

If it be manually pushed to wide open with it running ..it ISNT a governor problem,its a linkage/cable problem.



#10 Lauber1 ONLINE  

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Posted October 17, 2014 - 07:38 PM

you need to hook a tach to it and see where your even at rpm wise. you cant really tell if something is at the correct range by just seeing it.



#11 Spaceboy5 OFFLINE  

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Posted October 17, 2014 - 07:49 PM

You're right, but in this situation, I can see it. The throttle butterfly hits the wide open stop when the engine isn't running. But doesn't when it is. It's as simple as that. The throttle cable does allow it to reach the full throttle mark, but something else doesn't that is only in effect when the engine is running. That's why I say it's the governor. I've never had the machine miss or backfire, so the carb settings are correct. What might prevent a 50 year old governor from letting the engine run more than half throttle?



#12 Auburn David OFFLINE  

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Posted October 17, 2014 - 08:10 PM

You're right, but in this situation, I can see it. The throttle butterfly hits the wide open stop when the engine isn't running. But doesn't when it is. It's as simple as that. The throttle cable does allow it to reach the full throttle mark, but something else doesn't that is only in effect when the engine is running. That's why I say it's the governor. I've never had the machine miss or backfire, so the carb settings are correct. What might prevent a 50 year old governor from letting the engine run more than half throttle?

I have no clue..other than linkage that all I have..



#13 Spaceboy5 OFFLINE  

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Posted October 17, 2014 - 08:14 PM

Well thanks for the responses guys, I'll just have to keep looking and thinking. I'll let you know when I figure it out, and any other ideas are appreciated.



#14 Auburn David OFFLINE  

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Posted October 17, 2014 - 08:15 PM

Let us know what you find.



#15 Misteroni OFFLINE  

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Posted October 17, 2014 - 08:26 PM

Good luck with your problem! I can't really suggest anything, but if anything comes to mind, i'll let you know!


Edited by Misteroni, October 17, 2014 - 09:36 PM.





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