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Gt2000 Hydro Problems


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#16 OldBuzzard ONLINE  

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Posted October 30, 2014 - 10:11 AM

The OOM Manuals for my HT20D and HDT1000, which uses the Eaton 11 hydro both state:

 

 

 

Do not drive the tractor immediately after start up. Let the engine run

a few minutes to allow hydrostatic fluid to warm up first. ln extreme

cold weather the tractor should not be driven until the hydraulic lift

system is operating. Length of warm up will be determined by

temperature.

 

 

In the 1996 Service Seminar Book there is a list of Hydraulic fluids that are recommended for the Eaton 11:

 

 

 

DIESELTRACTOR AND 2-SPEED GASTRACTOR

TRANSMISSION/HYDRAULIC OIL CROSS REFERENCE

The following is a list of transmission/hydraulic fluids which may be substituted for the original factory-supplied oil when

you add or make routine transmission oil changes.

Allis Chalrners HPF821 Power Fluid

Amoco 1000

Atlantic Richfield Arco Tractor Ruid

J.I. Case TFD Fluid

Cheveron Tractor Hydraulic Fluid

Conoco Power·Tran II Fluid

John Deere Type 303 Special Purpose Oil

Exxon Torque Ruid 56

Ford 134 Tractor Hydraulic Fluid

Garden Way 1738157 (gal.)

International Hy-Trans Fluid

KendalL Hyken 052

Lion HT Fluid

Massey-Ferguson M-1127 Perma-Tran Fluid

Mobil Mobil fluid 424

Oliver Oliver 55 Fluid

Pennzoil. Hydra-Tranz & Wet Brake Fluid

Phillips HG Fluid

Ouaker Tractor HydrauliclTrans. Fluid

Shell Donnax T-4

Texaco TDH Oil

Union HydrauliclTrans. Fluid

Valvoline Unitrac

White 0-1722

 

 

 


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#17 Canawler OFFLINE  

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Posted October 30, 2014 - 12:43 PM

Canawler, could you tell me what oil filter you use for your hydro system and a rough quesstimate of the amount of oil to do a complete refill?

 

I just checked through the Bolens Duratrac service manual and it says the hydraulic systems requires 8 quarts.  It didn't specify if that was for the entire system (transaxle, steering cylinder, lift cylinder, filter) or just a transaxle drain and fill.  I'd bet it took pretty close to that on just my drain and fill.

 

The Bolens/Troy-bilt part number for the hydraulic filter is 1726450.  If you use Fram's cross reference it equates to a Fram PH2844.  I couldn't find one locally and didn't really want to use the basic Orange Can of Death (although the Fram Ultras are a great filter) so I checked what the Wix cross reference was for the PH2844.  The Wix number is 51410.  Funny thing is the Wix direct cross-over for the Bolens number is 51307.  They're dimensionally about the same filter but the 51410 has no bypass valve while the 51307 does.  Also, the 51410 filters down to 21 micron and the 51307 filters down to 15 micron.  I used the 51410 as you normally don't want a bypass valve in a hydraulic system.  The theory is that if something catastrophic were to happen, it would be better if the filter clogged and the system would loose pressure so you would know something happened.  With a bypass valve in place, the filter would clog and would go into bypass mode allowing debris to pass through the system without you realizing it immediately. 

There's also a Wix 57102 that's the same as the 51410 but filters down to 10 micron but you're getting pretty expensive as those run close to $30.

In case anyone doesn't know, Napa branded filters are made by Wix.  Napa just drops the first digit off the Wix number so you would be looking at Napa 1410, 7102, or 1307.

 

By the way, as a word of warning, the oil comes out of these transaxles pretty darn fast if you happen to pull the dipstick to vent them.  I left the deck on while draining the oil without even considering the oil steam might shoot forward two feet.....  all over the deck pulleys and belt. :wallbanging:    Won't do that again.

 

The OOM Manuals for my HT20D and HDT1000, which uses the Eaton 11 hydro both state:

 

Do not drive the tractor immediately after start up. Let the engine run

a few minutes to allow hydrostatic fluid to warm up first. ln extreme

cold weather the tractor should not be driven until the hydraulic lift

system is operating. Length of warm up will be determined by

temperature.

 

 

Very good info there.  It confirms that a little lag in the lift/power steering circuit during warm up is normal.


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#18 Bolens 1000 OFFLINE  

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Posted October 30, 2014 - 01:11 PM

Canawler, could you tell me what oil filter you use for your hydro system and a rough quesstimate of the amount of oil to do a complete refill?

 

I can get you a USA made aftermarket 1726450 filter or even a Genuine Bolens Filter

You got to watch when using auto parts stores, not all interchanges have the correct micron rating .



#19 Canawler OFFLINE  

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Posted October 31, 2014 - 09:10 AM

not all interchanges have the correct micron rating .


Do you have any specs on the original filters? I'd like to know what the micron rating was. As mentioned, the Fram and Wix cross references spec different micron ratings but I haven't seen what the originals were.

#20 bhts OFFLINE  

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Posted October 31, 2014 - 04:13 PM

Do you have any specs on the original filters? I'd like to know what the micron rating was. As mentioned, the Fram and Wix cross references spec different micron ratings but I haven't seen what the originals were.

You want to look for a 10 micron filter. I carry a couple different aftermaker and oem filters. The aftermarket ones run $13.18 for a rotary brand and $14.62 for the stens brand. Both are USA made and the OEM one runs $17.60



#21 creekscout OFFLINE  

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Posted November 06, 2014 - 05:11 PM

here is an update on my gtx 18, I got a wix 51410 filter for it and I purchased amsoil hydraullic-transmission oil for it. I had to do all this since the previous owner put a replacement hydraulic line on and used a compression fitting in the line which after I used it for 7 hours the line blew out of the compression fitting and I lost virtually all the fluid. I purchased a used hydraulic line off ebay for a bolens that fit exactly. So now I have filled it back up and everything seems to be working fine, however I do have a question concerning the fact that when I pull the dipstick to check the level afterwards it releases pressure built up in the system. Isn't there a breather anywhere in the system or is this what the purpose of a filter with a pressure relief valve would do. I really like this tractor and I hope after only 7 hours of use with it this is the only problem I have for quite awhile. bhts or Bolens1000 do any of the filters you list have a pressure relief valve?


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#22 Bolens 1000 OFFLINE  

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Posted November 06, 2014 - 05:33 PM

No, the OEM filters do not have pressure relief in them, sounds like a breather is clogged.

One of the Eaton guys should be along to tell you exactly where it is


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#23 Canawler OFFLINE  

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Posted November 06, 2014 - 07:29 PM

Mine holds pressure like that too. I assumed it was a clogged vent but there is no vent shown in the parts diagram and I sure couldn't find one on a thorough search of the transaxle. The Peerless transaxle on my MTD 990 is the same way, no vent.

Oil filters don't have a pressure relief valve, they have a bypass valve and/or an anti-drainback valve. The anti-drainback valve does just what the name implies and holds oil in the filter when mounted sideways or upside down. The bypass valve will allow the filter to go into bypass mode when a certain back pressure is reached, usually 7-9 psi. In other words, if the filter starts to get clogged, the filter will still pass oil, it just won't be filtered.
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#24 Cvans ONLINE  

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Posted December 13, 2014 - 08:57 PM

 

If you go into this, get some pics. I'd like to know more of how this all works!

  Today I started tearing down the GT2000 to see what might be causing the problem with the hydro. Removed all the body panels and it appears that the input shaft on the charge pump has a bad bearing and seal. There was some plastic like a shopping bag wrapped up in the shaft next to the seal. I don't imagine that helped the life of the seal at all and once it started sucking air the charge pump would probably lose it's prime. 

  Monday I hope to start working it and then I will be taking photos as I tear it down and reassemble it. 



#25 Cvans ONLINE  

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Posted December 15, 2014 - 09:12 PM

Not going to be any photos tonight as were have no electricity and are in a blizzard warning. Running on the generator.



#26 Cat385B ONLINE  

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Posted December 15, 2014 - 09:23 PM

Winds already picked up over there, Chris? Hope it doesn't last too long.


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#27 Cvans ONLINE  

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Posted December 16, 2014 - 12:15 AM

The snow has moved out and the lights are on  :thumbs:

So here are the photos. In the first is the complete hydro out in the open. Next I'm pointing at the charge pump which has a bad bushing and seal. Then the drive shaft is removed from the input shaft. In the fourth photo I'm pointing at the small snap ring that must be removed before the rotor can be taken out.

Fifth is the internal parts after being removed from the hydro. The shaft itself cannot be taken out at this point. I should mention that the charge pump housing is held to the hydro body with 5 Allen head screws. 2 square headed set screws hold the drive shaft to the input shaft.

It really surprises me that this shaft is supported by just a bushing. Would seem with the loads applied to this shaft that a roller bearing would have been justified. 

IMG_0052.JPG IMG_0053.JPG IMG_0054.JPG IMG_0056.JPG IMG_0058.JPG

 


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#28 Canawler OFFLINE  

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Posted December 16, 2014 - 08:31 AM

These photos are much appreciated.  It's nice to see what I'll eventually have to do to the GTX-18.



#29 Cvans ONLINE  

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Posted December 16, 2014 - 10:54 AM

 

 It's nice to see what I'll eventually have to do to the GTX-18.

 

It's not a bad job really. That pesky little snap ring took the most time as your not able to use a snap ring pliers. Just hope I can come up with the bushing for it as it looks like a bi-metal bushing similar to a rod bearing insert in a car. 

Kind of hoping that Old Buzzard is listening and might know a source. 



#30 Cvans ONLINE  

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Posted December 28, 2014 - 09:23 PM

Got it back together and the wheels turn.  :dancingbanana:

It is still up on stands and won't get to drive it until Wednesday as it is going to be near Zero for the next couple of days. 

The bushing is not available on it's own but the seal is.  :wallbanging:    Bought a standard SAE660 bronze bushing and machined it to fit. The OD was a perfect fit but the ID was around .003" under sized. Still have enough material for the other tractor. By the way, if you have any doubts about your shaft check it. The original bushing is steel backed with a bronze face and when you go through the thin bronze it is going to be steel running against steel. This can and probably will damage the input shaft. Getting that out to repair does not appear to be a simple task. I cannot understand why they didn't use a ball bearing here. The were available. 

Now there is very little play in the shaft and the pump is quiet. Darned thing threw out 2 quarts of oil when the seal went and never showed any outside the tractor. 

  If your tractor is slow to pick up prime when cold I would be checking the play in your charge pump shaft. The loader tractor will be getting the next check over. 


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