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Me Again With Another Question....


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#1 Likesspace OFFLINE  

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Posted March 26, 2014 - 06:31 PM

Well once again I'm stuck at home instead of going to the farm to work on the tractor. It's starting to tick me off a little but maybe tomorrow will work out better.

 

Anyway I'm looking to re-power the walking tractor with a different engine. 

After watching some Youtube videos I think I've decided to use a 5 HP Tecumseh snowblower engine since it will fit under the hood without any modifications to the tin work.

 

My question has to do with the shaft size that is needed to power the tractor.

The engine I'm looking at has a 3/4" diameter keyed driveshaft that is 2-1/4" long. Is this pretty common for a DB engine and will it work with the sheave that I have on the 3 HP Briggs that is currently on the tractor?

 

The model that I've found is a FS50 which does have the air cleaner instead of the winter heating box around the carb. There is no way that I would ever run an engine without an air cleaner, even in the winter.

 

I've always been more of a Briggs man but I do have an 11 hp tecumseh on a generator that I've had since the late 1990's. I can still go out and start it at anytime with just a couple of pulls as long as I do the regular maintenance on the carb.

 

So, if you can help me out with this question I would greatly appreciate it.

 


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#2 boyscout862 ONLINE  

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Posted March 27, 2014 - 05:12 AM

Most of the smaller engines are 3/4" dia. so, the pulley should fit. The height of the shaft may be different which will then require a different v belt. The mounting bolt pattern may be different too. Its best to measure these things before you start the  change over. It may be more work than it is worth. Good Luck, Rick


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#3 VSTROM803 OFFLINE  

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Posted March 27, 2014 - 08:11 AM

Well once again I'm stuck at home instead of going to the farm to work on the tractor. It's starting to tick me off a little but maybe tomorrow will work out better.

 

Anyway I'm looking to re-power the walking tractor with a different engine. 

After watching some Youtube videos I think I've decided to use a 5 HP Tecumseh snowblower engine since it will fit under the hood without any modifications to the tin work.

 

My question has to do with the shaft size that is needed to power the tractor.

The engine I'm looking at has a 3/4" diameter keyed driveshaft that is 2-1/4" long. Is this pretty common for a DB engine and will it work with the sheave that I have on the 3 HP Briggs that is currently on the tractor?

 

The model that I've found is a FS50 which does have the air cleaner instead of the winter heating box around the carb. There is no way that I would ever run an engine without an air cleaner, even in the winter.

 

I've always been more of a Briggs man but I do have an 11 hp tecumseh on a generator that I've had since the late 1990's. I can still go out and start it at anytime with just a couple of pulls as long as I do the regular maintenance on the carb.

 

So, if you can help me out with this question I would greatly appreciate it.

I have a 5hp Tecumseh on my 5756 tractor which works well. It's bolt pattern matches the DB engine mount. The engine is a tight squeeze but, it will fit under the hood with a lower profile air filter. I mofified an old Briggs filter to fit.

http://www.youtube.c...h?v=dt9guINxS2o

Since I made this video I've replaced the engine pulley with a reproduction of the original.


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#4 trowel OFFLINE  

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Posted March 27, 2014 - 08:36 AM

:ditto: the last of the walk behind used the Tehcumseh engine so it is the best match anyways, the 144 tractor.

The little Kohler K 141 is a very good and rebuildable engine that fits with little mods.

 

http://members.lsol....tors.htm#575143


Edited by trowel, March 27, 2014 - 08:38 AM.

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#5 Likesspace OFFLINE  

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Posted March 27, 2014 - 07:29 PM

Thanks for the information guys...

 

I went ahead and bought a HS50 Tecumseh this evening.

There was a seller on Ebay that has been selling brand new HS50 engines for the past year or so.

Supposedly he bought a ton of them back in the 70's or 80's. Some guys on a mini-bike forum have bought several of them and said that the exhaust comes wrapped in newspapers that range anywhere from 1971 to 1980. From what they've posted they are in the original packaging with all of the factory documentation. 

As far as torque goes I would rather have found a H50 but I wasn't sure that the big block design of that engine would have fit. The HS50 is more of a small block, but even then I might have to do the air filter swap that VSTROM showed in his video, (by the way....thanks for that video.....it was very informative).

If I could have found a K141 that would have been my first choice.

I have a K181 on my 1966 John Deere 110 and those little motors are a beast. My K181 spent over 10 years setting out in the weather with the plug removed, (before I bought it), and it was still in fine shape when I had it rebuilt. I think of them as being nearly indestructible. 

 

One other question....how well does the tin work on these machines hold up to sandblasting?

Looking at the hood it looks like it would be a nightmare to try and sand by hand and besides....someone decided to spray paint over rust on mine. I'm thinking that the only way it is ever going to look like I want it to is to blast it down to bare metal and then start filling in the pits with sand-able primer. 


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#6 Likesspace OFFLINE  

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Posted March 27, 2014 - 07:31 PM

Oh, and VSTROM.....can you please tell me where you got the reproduction engine pulley?

The outside pulley on mine has been broken so I definitely want to replace it.

 

Thanks,

Dave


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#7 trowel OFFLINE  

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Posted March 27, 2014 - 07:49 PM

You made a good choice with the small block HS50, it will give you plenty of power needed, the original tractors had 1 1/2 to 3 hp engines exsept for the 583 and 087 which had the Briggs 14 (hoodless) and 112 with the Wisconsin ACN (hoodless).

 

I have never ran into trouble plowing with the 104 3 hp tractor with both wheel weights, so long as the plow is set right it will roll over a strip of sod with you only guiding the tractor, i have see guys walk next to the tractor while it plowed on it's own with no aid.

Cultivating and harrowing is the same.

 

Sandblasted several tractor with no troubles, best way of cleaning it and using a knotted wire brush on a 4 inch angle grinder for the wide open spaces on the hood finishing up with the sandblaster.

All the tin work on the Tech engine can also be sandblasted if needed. If you wanted to follow the paint codes you could paint the Tech engine gray like the Continentals AU7 that originally powered them.

 

The fuel tank originally mounted above the chaincase and was the three ring tank, the hole on the top of the hood was for the fuel tank cap, if your is missing i have seen some mount a small ''tool'' box or such in it's place to house the starter rope, wrench and other odds and ends.


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#8 Likesspace OFFLINE  

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Posted March 27, 2014 - 08:05 PM

Trowel...

 

Thanks for the information...

 

Do you know if the HS50 will fit under the hood with the recoil starter?

The one that I purchased does have a recoil and after watching VSTROM's video I'm not sure that it will work.

If not I might be in the market for a rope pull starter like the one he shows in his video. I always seem to miss something when I think I have all bases covered. 

 

I have watched a couple of Youtube videos where a guy called Mrdanoconner used Tecumseh's with a recoil but they were actually snowblower motors. I'm not sure that this one is the same type that he used. 

 

Anyway the purchase has been made so I might have to cross that bridge when I come to it. I'm sure that whatever problems I run in to will be solvable with a little thought and planning.

 

By the way.....my wife was absolutely thrilled when I told her I was buying a new engine for the DB and also informed her that it will also need a new set of tires when I start the restoration. I think the only thing that thrilled her more was when I told her that I'm now thinking about going back and buying the other DB that was offered to me when I bought the first one.

Even though I didn't mention it I'm sure she would be very happy about the fact that he also has a tree saw and sicklebar mower available as well. I honestly don't have any use for either of these attachments but that doesn't mean that I don't want them. 

 

This whole DB thing is sort of like a crack addiction, isn't it?


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#9 trowel OFFLINE  

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Posted March 27, 2014 - 08:21 PM

This whole garden tractor collection is a addiction, it will consume you but in a good way.

Unlike drugs or alcohol the tractors are useful and if you enjoy tinkering will keep you busy.

I think just about all of use enjoy tinkering and using the tractors, it is only natural for someone born into this kind of hobby to either turn it into a business or continue to carry on the tradition.

 

The HS50 Tech should fit with the recoil, if not then i may be able to help using the same idea from using a Kohler K-161 engine.

 

As for the tree saw, that is a rather rare attachment, the saw blade was also used for bucking up firewood, below is Keven's cordwood saw using the same blade.

The reel mower is around but nice to show with the tractor if you ever take it to shows and meets, you could alway sell it to a DB collector which i am sure there are living around you.

 

Garden tractors collect some of the nicest people.

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Edited by trowel, March 27, 2014 - 08:24 PM.

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#10 VSTROM803 OFFLINE  

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Posted March 28, 2014 - 08:36 AM

Likesspace,

 

My father-in-law(a really good man I should add) had a friend machine it out for me. In fact, he made 2 for me. One is 3/4" bore for the Tech engine and the other is 1/2" bore like the original.

 

http://gardentractor...uction-pulleys/

 

 If you're getting an older Tech the recoil will likely fit. My Tech motor is much newer and has a larger recoil. It is about an inch larger in diameter than the hood opening. The rope pulley kinda kept it old school too.

 

When you get your engine mounted you will notice that the engine is a bit wider on the recoil side which will cause your hood to pull to that side slightly for the hood to close. It won't be a problem though. You may have to rotate your fuel tank a few degrees for the the filler cap to line up with the opening in the hood. Atleast that's how mine did. I'm very pleased with the fit though.


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#11 VSTROM803 OFFLINE  

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Posted March 28, 2014 - 09:01 AM

Yes, it is very addictive. If your wife is excited about you buying this stuff you should get the saw and sickle while the getting is good. LOL

 

I have a tree saw but, have not used it yet. I'd love to make a video of that since I have not seen one in action yet. You may find that the sickle can actually be handy if you have to mow areas you don't want the discharge to be blowing stuff every where like around you garden. I do prefer to use it on my differential tractors though since it shakes a lot. These tractors have the stronger 2 piece frames. 


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#12 Likesspace OFFLINE  

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Posted March 28, 2014 - 10:10 PM

Well I'm supposed to have my HS50 by Tuesday of next week. I won't be putting it into service for at least a couple of months since I want to use the tractor to put in my garden this year.

Once everything is planted I plan on tearing down the tractor and all of the implements and giving them at least a partial restoration. I'm not looking for showroom quality....just a nicer finish for a working machine. 

 

If I do need to replace the recoil with a rope start are these briggs rope starts still available?

Also I'm almost positive that I will need to re-work the air filter but thanks to VSTROM803 I've got that covered.

 

My co-worker is going to go ahead and buy the other tractor so I guess I'm out of luck there. I'm beginning to realize that when it comes to DB tractors and attachments one should treat them like a good mushroom patch.......brag about he mushrooms but keep the patch location secret. :-)

 

I might still go down and buy one of the sickle bars and the tree saw. After giving it some though the tree saw might be really handy for cutting underbrush around the farm. As for the sickle bar I still think that, (in my case at least), more of a novelty item that I would probably never have much of a use for. Regardless it IS still a DB attachment so it might be worth having just for the coolness factor.

If I remember correctly neither the tree saw or the sickle bar mower has any type of operating linkage, (sort of what operates the clutch on the tractor). I don't know that these items actually need this but it seems to me that there would have to be some way to turn them on and off. If they do need some sort of linkage is this something that can me made?

 

And VSTROM...as I'm sure you've guessed, my wife is not all that thrilled with my recent purchases. Regardless she sees that these can be useful on our mini-farm so she's humoring my newest obsession. 

 

We are hoping to take at least partial retirement within 10 years and make a subsidiary living with a produce farm and orchard. For the past few years we have been building the farm and orchard and plan on continuing to do so until that day comes.

 

If all things work out I will be 60 and she will be 52 when we step away from the rat race. 

What's funny is that I never wanted to be a farmer, (although that has been my family's business since the 1800's), in the conventional sense. I want to do fruits and vegetables and do my best to live off of the land. 

In the long run it might turn out to be a pipe dream but it sure is a nice one to have.


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#13 Likesspace OFFLINE  

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Posted March 28, 2014 - 10:16 PM

Oh and just to put this out there....

 

If I buy the tree saw I would be willing to trade it to anyone that has a reel mower attachment that they would be willing to get rid of.

We have a croquet, bocce, and badminton court on our lawn and a reel mower is the perfect tool for keeping it perfect. I could buy a powered reel mower to do the job but.....well you know...I'd much rather use the DB instead of some new piece of box store equipment. 



#14 VSTROM803 OFFLINE  

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Posted March 29, 2014 - 04:53 AM

I got the rope pulley from ebay. It was listed just as I needed it and no one bid against me. Lucky me!

 

I look forward to seeing your tractor and your progress with it.






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