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Options For New Heart In Jd400


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#46 KennyP ONLINE  

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Posted March 28, 2014 - 04:58 PM

That is something I cannot explain, but a heater core can only do so much. That's why they call them heater core's, the air coming out is hot. You need something that will dissipate the heat! My K3D has a very large radiator, about the size of most cars!


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#47 Cvans ONLINE  

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Posted March 28, 2014 - 09:40 PM

 

 

Its tough though to buy one and not know for sure if it will fit inside the 400 frame before the engine is placed.

Your right about this. I have several that I purchased used setting in the shed that are no longer usable because of modifications. 

The best thing to do find a parts book for the piece of equipment that the engine came out of and get the dimensions of that radiator. Or find something with a similar sized engine and measure that radiator. Your also going to need adequate air flow. 



#48 trowel OFFLINE  

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Posted March 28, 2014 - 09:58 PM

Your right about this. I have several that I purchased used setting in the shed that are no longer usable because of modifications. 

The best thing to do find a parts book for the piece of equipment that the engine came out of and get the dimensions of that radiator. Or find something with a similar sized engine and measure that radiator. Your also going to need adequate air flow. 

Have seen a lot of conversions using radiators from auxiliary power units and reefer units, Yanmar, Kubota and Perkins.

Some have doubled the heater core, one on top of the other with a good strong electric or belt driven fan, if so make sure you put a cover around the fan creating a funnel of air to the radiator.

 

For conversions it is hard to beat the simplicity of a air cooled engine.


Edited by trowel, March 28, 2014 - 09:58 PM.


#49 Utah Smitty OFFLINE  

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Posted March 28, 2014 - 10:49 PM

So what is the rule for proper cooling of an engine?  Im learning as I go with diesel engines of this size.  Im use to dealing with white superior and KATO engines at work.

 

I did find one online that has the specs below.  Its tough though to buy one and not know for sure if it will fit inside the 400 frame before the engine is placed.

 

Size (approximately): 12.5” long, 12” tall, 1.5” thick

7.5” between pins

7/8” Inlet/Outlet diameter

 

I sent you a PM on this as well, but for the "educational enhancement" of the other forum members, I measured the radiator from my Mitsi L3E that came off a Volvo Mini Excavator.  It does have an engine oil cooler hook-up--similar to the ones for automatic transmissions in cars, so it's probably a little oversized.

 

Anyway, it's a cross flow radiator, and the core measures 16" wide by 15" high x 3" thick with at least 4 rows of tubes in it.  The inlet and outlet fittings are 1" ID or 1 1/8" OD.  Here's some pics:

 

MITSUBISHI L3E RADIATOR & SHROUD.jpg MITSUBISHI L3E RADIATOR.jpg

IMG_20140328_204753_2831.jpg

 

As you can see, the inlet and outlet are both on the left side of the radiator as you're sitting in the tractor, and the cooler ports are on the right hand side. 

 

This radiator would probably fit inside either of our hoods if it didn't have the tanks on the sides.

 

Regards,

 

Smitty



#50 Utah Smitty OFFLINE  

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Posted March 28, 2014 - 10:54 PM

That is something I cannot explain, but a heater core can only do so much. That's why they call them heater core's, the air coming out is hot. You need something that will dissipate the heat! My K3D has a very large radiator, about the size of most cars!

I don't know how to calculate the rate of heat exchange--I never took thermodynamics in college, but I do know that heat exchange is a function of the amount of surface area exposed to the air flow.  Thus you can have a large radiator, but if it only has two rows of tubes it may not cool as well as a smaller one with 4 rows of tubes.

 

When it comes to cooling a tractor engine, I've always found it best to get as much radiator as you can, especially since the airflow from vehicle movement is low or non-existent.

 

FWIW,

 

Smitty



#51 Utah Smitty OFFLINE  

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Posted March 28, 2014 - 11:05 PM

I found this radiator on eBay... I think it will fit under our hoods--may be a little long...

 

http://www.ebay.com/...6cfdb01&vxp=mtr

 

I'm gonna go check my hood right now.

 

Smitty



#52 Cvans ONLINE  

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Posted March 28, 2014 - 11:54 PM

 

 

When it comes to cooling a tractor engine, I've always found it best to get as much radiator as you can, especially since the airflow from vehicle movement is low or non-existent.

Some of the best advise available.  :iagree: 

Smitty I sure hope that radiator works for you because the price is exceptional.


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#53 Pager450n OFFLINE  

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Posted March 29, 2014 - 05:41 PM

I will look into the radiator as the time draws closer.  Now im looking into how I will be getting a PTO mounted on both ends of the L3E.

Heres a pic of the pulley side.  I need to figure out how to get a pto stub shaft on it so I can get power to the hydrostatic

IMG_5114-M.jpg



#54 Utah Smitty OFFLINE  

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Posted March 30, 2014 - 09:00 AM

:

Some of the best advise available.  :iagree: 
Smitty I sure hope that radiator works for you because the price is exceptional.


Thanks, Chris. turns out it will fit okay with my forward facing engine, but Ryan's engine is rear facing and there isn't room to clear the prop shaft.

Do you know if Sundstrand Hydros can be reversed? That way Ryan could mount his engine facing forward...

Smitty

#55 Utah Smitty OFFLINE  

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Posted March 30, 2014 - 09:04 AM

I will look into the radiator as the time draws closer.  Now im looking into how I will be getting a PTO mounted on both ends of the L3E.
Heres a pic of the pulley side.  I need to figure out how to get a pto stub shaft on it so I can get power to the hydrostatic
IMG_5114-M.jpg


Ryan I think we need to make a coupler that will fit tightly into the slight counterbore on the pulley, then run bolts through the holes. OR--it may be that a front pulley off another Mitsi L3e will work... The Toro 223Ds drove from the front of the engine.

Smitty

#56 olcowhand ONLINE  

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Posted March 30, 2014 - 09:14 AM

I found this radiator on eBay... I think it will fit under our hoods--may be a little long...

 

http://www.ebay.com/...6cfdb01&vxp=mtr

 

I'm gonna go check my hood right now.

 

Smitty

 

That's the radiator I'm using in my Bush Hog HD-12 diesel conversion.  My engine being just a 14hp, the 2 core is plenty, but that radiator also comes in a 3 core version:  HERE


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#57 KennyP ONLINE  

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Posted March 30, 2014 - 09:17 AM

Ryan I think we need to make a coupler that will fit tightly into the slight counterbore on the pulley, then run bolts through the holes. OR--it may be that a front pulley off another Mitsi L3e will work... The Toro 223Ds drove from the front of the engine.

Smitty

So does the K3D in the 322D Toro. Wonder if the pulleys are the same?



#58 Pager450n OFFLINE  

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Posted March 30, 2014 - 12:03 PM

Ryan I think we need to make a coupler that will fit tightly into the slight counterbore on the pulley, then run bolts through the holes. OR--it may be that a front pulley off another Mitsi L3e will work... The Toro 223Ds drove from the front of the engine.

Smitty

 

I dug into the stash last night and found a kohler stub that is roughly 7" long w/ a 1" od keyed shaft.  It will work great IF I can get it tunred down enough on the under to have it seat into the counterbore.  It looks like it only needs an 1/8" or so, now I need to find someone to turn it down for me. 

 

 

 

IMG_5116-L.jpg

 

Would i be ok using this on the pulley side of the engine?  This will work as far as clearance from the fan and driveshaft coupler, just not sure about that weight hanging on this drive pulley


Edited by Pager450n, March 30, 2014 - 12:19 PM.


#59 Pager450n OFFLINE  

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Posted March 30, 2014 - 12:11 PM

:
Thanks, Chris. turns out it will fit okay with my forward facing engine, but Ryan's engine is rear facing and there isn't room to clear the prop shaft.

Do you know if Sundstrand Hydros can be reversed? That way Ryan could mount his engine facing forward...

Smitty

 

The one problem I would run into by flipping the tranny is for the front PTO, and it would run CCW.  If I didnt have the 35A tiller, I wouldnt hesitate to flip the tranny and get the radiator in the front.   I need to get the engine in so I can start my search for the radiator needed.

 

If this dang Mitsu used four bolt patterns on its pulleys and flywheel, I wouldnt have this isssue


Edited by Pager450n, March 30, 2014 - 12:13 PM.


#60 Cvans ONLINE  

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Posted March 30, 2014 - 02:40 PM

 

 

Would i be ok using this on the pulley side of the engine? 

You want to keep your load as close the the anchor point as possible. If it were me, I'd turn that shaft back as close to the flange as I could. That way the side loads on your pulley that your bolting to would be a lot less. If you were closer you could just bring it over and we could ( you doing the machining  :D ) get her done for you. 






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