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Sub Compact Tractors--Share Your Experience, Please!

scut sub-compact

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#91 Pager450n OFFLINE  

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Posted February 18, 2014 - 08:40 AM

Smitty,

 I have been watching this thread.  I have a kubota B8200HST with a loader, backhoe.  Your more than welcome to swing by and take a look at it, ask questions.  I was in your stituation, and wanted a CUT to help out a little more than what my 400 could do.  Its been a life saver.  Although it does not have PS, I have a jd 400 actuator and will install it this summer.  All in all, I have been very pleased with it.  Hydrostatic speed, 3 speed range, 19hp, weight around 1600lbs. 

Again, your welcome to take a look and visit.  Would be great to meet another UT lgt guy. 

 

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#92 Utah Smitty OFFLINE  

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Posted February 18, 2014 - 12:13 PM

Smitty,

 I have been watching this thread.  I have a kubota B8200HST with a loader, backhoe.  Your more than welcome to swing by and take a look at it, ask questions.  I was in your stituation, and wanted a CUT to help out a little more than what my 400 could do.  Its been a life saver.  Although it does not have PS, I have a jd 400 actuator and will install it this summer.  All in all, I have been very pleased with it.  Hydrostatic speed, 3 speed range, 19hp, weight around 1600lbs. 

Again, your welcome to take a look and visit.  Would be great to meet another UT lgt guy. 

 

Page

I read your PM--call me or PM your phone number to me...

 

Smitty



#93 JD DANNELS OFFLINE  

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Posted February 18, 2014 - 12:31 PM

Thanks for the info on the Massey's, Luke.  Can you still get good parts support for them from Agco? 

 

That's one of the problems I've found with many "name brand" tractors that were built in Japan--if they're more than 10 years old, the dealers don't want to support them.  There's a guy here locally that's been trying to sell a M-F205 for 3 months now, but now luck.  Ditto for a Mitubishi, and a Yanmar greymarket machine.

 

Smitty

I like the Massey Ferguson machines and would not hesitate to get one if there is a Good dealer in your area.  The Dealer in my county is into large equipment and Skagg Comercial mowing equipment(He has dropped the Massey line). There are a number of good dealers about 60-70 miles from me.


Edited by JD DANNELS, February 18, 2014 - 12:32 PM.

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#94 Utah Smitty OFFLINE  

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Posted February 18, 2014 - 02:05 PM

I like the Massey Ferguson machines and would not hesitate to get one if there is a Good dealer in your area.  The Dealer in my county is into large equipment and Skagg Comercial mowing equipment(He has dropped the Massey line). There are a number of good dealers about 60-70 miles from me.

Thanks.  I'm not sure there's an Agco dealer in the whole state of Utah, although Ford and New Holland were pretty popular brands.

 

I saw a M-F/Hinomoto compact tractor with a loader for sale on our local classifieds at a real reasonable price.  I did a little research, however, and found that, this model at least, uses an aluminum bellhousing and there have been some cases of the BHs breaking or bolts stripping out.

 

Do you know if the other M-F models have Alum BH"s as well?

 

Smitty



#95 JD DANNELS OFFLINE  

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Posted February 18, 2014 - 02:39 PM

I really don't know what models had the aluminum Housings?   The dealer in Oskaloosa called me right after I bought my Ford and had a real good deal on a new 1526. But I had to pass on it then.  That dealer in Prairie City I mentioned had a used GC 2600 when I was looking.

It had been his wife & daughters machine. He was selling it because they decided to do a Market Garden and sell produce at the Farmers Market in Des Moines (We called them Truck Patches when I was a kid) and he set them up with a 1526 because it had more ground clearance when driving over crops.


Edited by JD DANNELS, February 18, 2014 - 02:43 PM.


#96 js5020 OFFLINE  

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Posted February 18, 2014 - 03:38 PM

Thanks.  I'm not sure there's an Agco dealer in the whole state of Utah, although Ford and New Holland were pretty popular brands.

 

I saw a M-F/Hinomoto compact tractor with a loader for sale on our local classifieds at a real reasonable price.  I did a little research, however, and found that, this model at least, uses an aluminum bellhousing and there have been some cases of the BHs breaking or bolts stripping out.

 

Do you know if the other M-F models have Alum BH"s as well?

 

Smitty

Dont know the exacting models but I would suspect anything before 1988/89, Im not sure when Agco changed to Iseki builds. It was the Hinomotos that had the aluminum housing as far as I knew.


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#97 Cvans ONLINE  

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Posted February 18, 2014 - 05:19 PM

If I had to guess, I'd say they switched to Iseki when Hinomoto closed down operation.

Parts for the Hinomoto's can be hard to come by. Years ago there was one in the local ads that was very nice for a great price. Did some checking and found that parts were just about none existent. 



#98 Utah Smitty OFFLINE  

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Posted February 18, 2014 - 06:40 PM

If I had to guess, I'd say they switched to Iseki when Hinomoto closed down operation.

Parts for the Hinomoto's can be hard to come by. Years ago there was one in the local ads that was very nice for a great price. Did some checking and found that parts were just about none existent. 

Yeah, that's what I found ot about this M-F locally.  It's a shame, as M-F was a very common tractor around here when I was young... always had a soft spot in my heart for them.

 

Smitty



#99 js5020 OFFLINE  

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Posted February 18, 2014 - 07:49 PM

Buying a used machine can be a difficult endeavor,most either have a ton of hours,had the tar beat out of em' no parts support or way over priced,,,, and if your financing a nice used low hr machine alot of times a new one has zero finance and a warranty for little more coin.
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#100 Luke OFFLINE  

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Posted February 18, 2014 - 10:38 PM

I don't know much about the pre-Agco buyout Massey Ferguson compact tractors but my guess is Cvans is correct. I believe my tractors have cast steel bellhousings on them. One other note is the Iseki Diesel engine runs smooth at idle to full throttle! They are surprising quiet with hardly any diesel rattling pinging noise associated with older compact diesel engines of years past. Only thing I'm not fond of with this engine is its a hard starting dude...... Have to use the glow plugs even when it's over 70 degrees. Better plan on plugging it in if below freezing! Besides that these Massey tractors are one of my best investments to date, no regrets here! And no I'm not a Massey salesman or get any commission off of a sale! Lol Good luck in your decision! Luke
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#101 trowel OFFLINE  

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Posted February 18, 2014 - 11:19 PM

Ok, heres mines.

The Ford 1200 (Shibaura) is just like Iseki and Kubota, Jap tractors, smooth running, soft blow with the precombustion chamber.

Harder then hell to start in the winter just like all the other Jap engines, Lister Petter has always been my winter diesels,..anyways,..

Very durable and rugged. Now mind you, it is a over sized GT, not rated a farm tractor so as heavy as it is it still has the same troubles as a weighted large frame GT if you would compare, even with the bucket, this is without the extra weights.

As far as general work around the farm and kennels and plowing it works a dream and saves lots on fuel cost compared with gas powered compacts. The most important is to fit the tractor to your needs, something was needed between the Hesston DT680 and Sears SS10, the Ford filled that gap perfetly.

OEM parts are obsoleted and aftermarket parts drying up, will have to be retired someday, if you was to ask me i am thinking i might replace it someday with a Kubota. Have always favored the older b600 and b700 series with a bucket, OEM parts are everywere and cheaper, durable and dependible.

Hard starting in the winter but i am growing use to that.


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#102 Utah Smitty OFFLINE  

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Posted February 19, 2014 - 12:15 AM

Ok, heres mines.

The Ford 1200 (Shibaura) is just like Iseki and Kubota, Jap tractors, smooth running, soft blow with the precombustion chamber.

Harder then hell to start in the winter just like all the other Jap engines, Lister Petter has always been my winter diesels,..anyways,..

Very durable and rugged. Now mind you, it is a over sized GT, not rated a farm tractor so as heavy as it is it still has the same troubles as a weighted large frame GT if you would compare, even with the bucket, this is without the extra weights.

As far as general work around the farm and kennels and plowing it works a dream and saves lots on fuel cost compared with gas powered compacts. The most important is to fit the tractor to your needs, something was needed between the Hesston DT680 and Sears SS10, the Ford filled that gap perfetly.

OEM parts are obsoleted and aftermarket parts drying up, will have to be retired someday, if you was to ask me i am thinking i might replace it someday with a Kubota. Have always favored the older b600 and b700 series with a bucket, OEM parts are everywere and cheaper, durable and dependible.

Hard starting in the winter but i am growing use to that.

Good information there, thanks.  I've found that parts for some of the older Ford models are also hard to find--the more's the pity as there's a bunch of them here in Utah.

 

Smitty


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#103 Utah Smitty OFFLINE  

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Posted February 19, 2014 - 12:18 AM

I don't know much about the pre-Agco buyout Massey Ferguson compact tractors but my guess is Cvans is correct. I believe my tractors have cast steel bellhousings on them. One other note is the Iseki Diesel engine runs smooth at idle to full throttle! They are surprising quiet with hardly any diesel rattling pinging noise associated with older compact diesel engines of years past. Only thing I'm not fond of with this engine is its a hard starting dude...... Have to use the glow plugs even when it's over 70 degrees. Better plan on plugging it in if below freezing! Besides that these Massey tractors are one of my best investments to date, no regrets here! And no I'm not a Massey salesman or get any commission off of a sale! Lol Good luck in your decision! Luke

Reaching back over 30 years ago to my diesel shop classes in college, I seem to remember that diesels with a pre-combustion chamber are harder to start than a direct injection engine. I imagine the cold metal of the head makes it hard for the fuel to warm up as it flows out of the pre-comb into the cylinder.  OTOH, PC diesels are quieter and supposedly more fuel efficient and less polluting.

 

I have an 85 Ford F250 with a 6.9 Navistar diesel and a turbo kit.  It's hard to start in the winter as well, though the glow plugs do a good job.

 

Smitty


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#104 trowel OFFLINE  

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Posted February 19, 2014 - 09:03 AM

Reaching back over 30 years ago to my diesel shop classes in college, I seem to remember that diesels with a pre-combustion chamber are harder to start than a direct injection engine. I imagine the cold metal of the head makes it hard for the fuel to warm up as it flows out of the pre-comb into the cylinder.  OTOH, PC diesels are quieter and supposedly more fuel efficient and less polluting.

 

I have an 85 Ford F250 with a 6.9 Navistar diesel and a turbo kit.  It's hard to start in the winter as well, though the glow plugs do a good job.

 

Smitty

You got it, and the compression ratios are usually lower on the pre-comb engines, soft blow types but lends itself quite well to burning the lower grade ultra low junk preigniting it until everything was burn, they use to be known as smokers when compared with the dirctly injected counterparts. The direct injected diesels tend to favor the higher grades of fuel, injectors tend to soot up with the low grade fuels being it had a slower burn ratio/flash point, the pre squash zone is built into the piston and around the injector in the head and is more liken to a air compressor head then the pre comb old diesels.

When a lot of the Mfgs moved the injector to the top of the head directly above the piston tilted at a 30 degree angle between the valves, using the dimpled piston and uniquely shaped head it improved swirl just before ignition flashing outwards from the center, before that it was screwed horizontally into the head and the the squash zone was around the valves meaning comb. was flashed across the piston and head hence the slowness of the old diesels but the slower burn made for smoother running with the lower compression ratios.

Which it better ? depends on the application, up to the user to judge.

The newer Kubotas has saddened me with the direction it is going in for the US market hence me stating a used one for rebuild instead of new, a close friend of mines has two newer ones, forget the model numbers right now, the small pressured charged two cylinder one is basiclly the slightly bigger revamped vertion of B600 series but with less weight, the other is three cylinder pressure charged rated closer to the ''farm tractor'' slighly bigger then the old B700 series, both have higher horse power with shuttle shift, starts easy, is very fast and easy to use but mine you, they are new computer controled type tractors, parts are expensive and takes a while to come in depending on the part and the derability seems lower.

Like you i am thinking about compact tractors and it seems the Kubota has really gained in popularity here on the east coast for work tractors hence my interest in them when compared with others but i will watch this thread and learn.


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#105 Utah Smitty OFFLINE  

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Posted February 19, 2014 - 10:27 AM

You got it, and the compression ratios are usually lower on the pre-comb engines, soft blow types but lends itself quite well to burning the lower grade ultra low junk preigniting it until everything was burn, they use to be known as smokers when compared with the dirctly injected counterparts. The direct injected diesels tend to favor the higher grades of fuel, injectors tend to soot up with the low grade fuels being it had a slower burn ratio/flash point, the pre squash zone is built into the piston and around the injector in the head and is more liken to a air compressor head then the pre comb old diesels.
When a lot of the Mfgs moved the injector to the top of the head directly above the piston tilted at a 30 degree angle between the valves, using the dimpled piston and uniquely shaped head it improved swirl just before ignition flashing outwards from the center, before that it was screwed horizontally into the head and the the squash zone was around the valves meaning comb. was flashed across the piston and head hence the slowness of the old diesels but the slower burn made for smoother running with the lower compression ratios.
Which it better ? depends on the application, up to the user to judge.
The newer Kubotas has saddened me with the direction it is going in for the US market hence me stating a used one for rebuild instead of new, a close friend of mines has two newer ones, forget the model numbers right now, the small pressured charged two cylinder one is basiclly the slightly bigger revamped vertion of B600 series but with less weight, the other is three cylinder pressure charged rated closer to the ''farm tractor'' slighly bigger then the old B700 series, both have higher horse power with shuttle shift, starts easy, is very fast and easy to use but mine you, they are new computer controled type tractors, parts are expensive and takes a while to come in depending on the part and the derability seems lower.
Like you i am thinking about compact tractors and it seems the Kubota has really gained in popularity here on the east coast for work tractors hence my interest in them when compared with others but i will watch this thread and learn.

In my research, I'm finding that the Yanmars are easier to start. There also seems to be more aftermarket and used parts for them.

 

The Kubotas have a large dealer network--we have more Kubota dealers in Utah then any other. There are 5 within a 70 mile radius of me, with only 1 JD and Case/IH in the same area. But, they are all in lock step with their parts prices, and WILL NOT sell you parts or service your tractor if they know you have a grey market machine.

Yanmar doesn't have much of a dealer network, though they are building now that they're aggressively selling Cub Cadet/Yanmar compacts. Also, there are a LOT of grey market Yanmar's here, and used parts and a/m parts support is good for popular models--Hoye Tractor parts has a list of models to avoid on their website.

One other note--Yanmar has been building engines, and complete tractors for John Deere since the 80's if not earlier. There is some similarity between JD and Yanmar models, and I'm sure many parts will interchange, but be careful as many things--like engines, have been "tweaked" for JD and Yanmar engine parts may not  bolt right up to a JD even if they're the same model. The engines in the JD430 are one example.

Smitty


Edited by Utah Smitty, February 19, 2014 - 10:45 AM.






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