Jump to content

Nominations for Tractor of the Month
Garden Tractors and Parts on eBay



Photo
- - - - -

Ford 1200


  • Please log in to reply
21 replies to this topic

#1 trowel OFFLINE  

trowel

    Summer.

  • Senior Member
  • -GTt Supporter-
  • Member No: 5127
  • 4,819 Thanks
  • 4,533 posts
  • Location: ma.

Posted February 06, 2014 - 07:14 PM

Think it may have a dirty injector or air leak at the injector, had no time to pull and check.

 

Would fire and run on # 2 cylinder, # 1 just huffed smoke, # 1 would fire with #2 for a few rev then only # 2 would run with the starter helping it along, checked the fuel line and injector pump for leaks, loosened and tightened the injector.

Pulled the air cleaner and kept cranking while # 2 popping until # 1 took off.

When # 1 fired she blew a lot of black smoke clearing after a few min.

Was going to spray/dribble water around the injector for bubble test and may lead to pulling and checking the injector for dirty nozzle.

Runs good and power is the same, worked it hard today pushing 12 inches of snow, mostly in high range.

Would like to check the valve lash but can not find the manual for the 1200 specs.

Any idears, comments would be a help, kick this around for a few.

Thanks.


Edited by trowel, February 06, 2014 - 07:17 PM.

  • boyscout862 said thank you

#2 JD DANNELS OFFLINE  

JD DANNELS

    Tractorholic

  • Senior Member
  • Member No: 2011
  • 3,786 Thanks
  • 3,907 posts
  • Location: Newton.Ia

Posted February 06, 2014 - 10:29 PM

Well you pretty well described how my 1500 has been starting this winter. I am not 100 % sure what is causing it, but have a few ideas. The tank was full going into winter and the fuel had been in the 5 gal can since November. These darn things burn so little fuel I think the fuel can go a bit skunky before you burn a full tank when not running them often? I have never had more than a puff of black when starting up until this winter. I am laying it off to the fuel having been around too long and not having burned enough to keep it fresh? I picked up a bottle of power service and a fresh can of fuel tonight. We are supposed to get another couple inches of snow tomorrow night into Saturday morning. Saturday I will fill the tank with the treated fuel and push off any snow we get and push the piles back. I suspect that the fresh fuel with power service will clear the problem. Another thought I have often wondered if one of the glow plugs was a bit weak? Might want to check the contact (seems to me like there is a brass bar that runs between the plugs to see if there is any corrosion causing a weak contact to one plug? Since your 1200 is very much like my 1500, just a couple sizes down. They sure are fun !! I will let you know how it goes Saturday.

Edited by JD DANNELS, February 06, 2014 - 10:34 PM.

  • trowel and boyscout862 have said thanks

#3 skyrydr2 ONLINE  

skyrydr2

    Tractorholic

  • Senior Member
  • -GTt Supporter-
  • Contributor
  • Member No: 5032
  • 3,409 Thanks
  • 3,159 posts
  • Location: Gardner, Massachusetts!

Posted February 07, 2014 - 04:13 AM

Your injectors are possibly leaking. Also the cold does not help much either. Those rigs really need to be somewhat warm to start good. I had a Yanmar that was the same way. When I fixed the injectors it would start without miss fire but still took a lot of effort to get it going.
to .These little boogers like to crank fast to start!! Even the Kubota 3cylinder i have completely sucks to start cold!! I have a magnetic block heater on the oil pan and a trickle charger on the battery all the time when it drops below 40°! And if its below zero.... I have to use my toredo heater to warm it up so it will even fire... Now the two 4 cylinder rigs we have... They litterally turn maybe 1 or 2 pistons before they fire at -10° not plugged in!!! So why is this ??? Bigger bore maybe? Better injection? Not sure, but if any have bad battery components..... GAME OVER!!!!
  • Alc, trowel and boyscout862 have said thanks

#4 Alc ONLINE  

Alc

    Tractorholic

  • Senior Member
  • -GTt Supporter-
  • Contributor
  • Member No: 1094
  • 5,450 Thanks
  • 6,618 posts
  • Location: Bangor Pa

Posted February 07, 2014 - 06:31 AM

Do you guys use any additive like this ? We have our inground fuel treated with some type of additive when we get deliveries but if we have a unit that is a little fussy we'll add this too . We never know if the truck will be working at a location that there isn't a place to plug the block heaters in

 

http://www.powerservice.com/dfs/


  • KennyP and trowel have said thanks

#5 trowel OFFLINE  

trowel

    Summer.

  • Senior Member
  • -GTt Supporter-
  • Member No: 5127
  • 4,819 Thanks
  • 4,533 posts
  • Location: ma.

Posted February 07, 2014 - 06:41 AM

Well you pretty well described how my 1500 has been starting this winter. I am not 100 % sure what is causing it, but have a few ideas. The tank was full going into winter and the fuel had been in the 5 gal can since November. These darn things burn so little fuel I think the fuel can go a bit skunky before you burn a full tank when not running them often? I have never had more than a puff of black when starting up until this winter. I am laying it off to the fuel having been around too long and not having burned enough to keep it fresh? I picked up a bottle of power service and a fresh can of fuel tonight. We are supposed to get another couple inches of snow tomorrow night into Saturday morning. Saturday I will fill the tank with the treated fuel and push off any snow we get and push the piles back. I suspect that the fresh fuel with power service will clear the problem. Another thought I have often wondered if one of the glow plugs was a bit weak? Might want to check the contact (seems to me like there is a brass bar that runs between the plugs to see if there is any corrosion causing a weak contact to one plug? Since your 1200 is very much like my 1500, just a couple sizes down. They sure are fun !! I will let you know how it goes Saturday.

Please do,, i will check the glow plugs, there is a bar between the plugs, will clean the contacts.



#6 skyrydr2 ONLINE  

skyrydr2

    Tractorholic

  • Senior Member
  • -GTt Supporter-
  • Contributor
  • Member No: 5032
  • 3,409 Thanks
  • 3,159 posts
  • Location: Gardner, Massachusetts!

Posted February 07, 2014 - 07:04 AM

The best thing I have done so far is add Diesel-911 additive to my little Kubota diesel's fuel tank!! It starts a lot better now and makes a little more power too. I run it almost all year round, except the dead of summer, other than that, it gets added at every tank up.
  • KennyP and trowel have said thanks

#7 trowel OFFLINE  

trowel

    Summer.

  • Senior Member
  • -GTt Supporter-
  • Member No: 5127
  • 4,819 Thanks
  • 4,533 posts
  • Location: ma.

Posted February 07, 2014 - 07:06 AM

Your injectors are possibly leaking. Also the cold does not help much either. Those rigs really need to be somewhat warm to start good. I had a Yanmar that was the same way. When I fixed the injectors it would start without miss fire but still took a lot of effort to get it going.
to .These little boogers like to crank fast to start!! Even the Kubota 3cylinder i have completely sucks to start cold!! I have a magnetic block heater on the oil pan and a trickle charger on the battery all the time when it drops below 40°! And if its below zero.... I have to use my toredo heater to warm it up so it will even fire... Now the two 4 cylinder rigs we have... They litterally turn maybe 1 or 2 pistons before they fire at -10° not plugged in!!! So why is this ??? Bigger bore maybe? Better injection? Not sure, but if any have bad battery components..... GAME OVER!!!!

That is what i was thinking due to the grey/black smoke, did not hear any hissing from air escaping but i was by myself and # 1 is far away from me. Left the charger on trickle and block heater all night and morning until afternoon, was thinking of trying the the dipstick heater.

 Yanmars are by far the hardest to start in the winter, don't even bother with mines, the mini Yanmar compression ratio is 12.5 to 1, bore is around 2 inch, a bad joke in the winter, summer diesels, the bore does make a difference, bigger means more loading up the cylinders with more fuel making for hotter firing, small diesels sux to start in winter.

The single cylinder air cooled lister Petter is a 1800 rpm generator unit, will fire at below using only the glow plugs and always keep it loaded. The ST Lister is a little harder but the same, both have flywheel starter and crank starter and both have warm air intakes, im thinking it is the combustion chamber (squash zone) and valve timing. I might tighten the valves in the Ford if specs could be found on lash.



#8 trowel OFFLINE  

trowel

    Summer.

  • Senior Member
  • -GTt Supporter-
  • Member No: 5127
  • 4,819 Thanks
  • 4,533 posts
  • Location: ma.

Posted February 07, 2014 - 07:13 AM

Do you guys use any additive like this ? We have our inground fuel treated with some type of additive when we get deliveries but if we have a unit that is a little fussy we'll add this too . We never know if the truck will be working at a location that there isn't a place to plug the block heaters in

 

http://www.powerservice.com/dfs/

Better safe then sorry is how i do it too, additive were added, i started cutting the diesel with non synthetic tranny fluid, around 1/4 of a quart to 300 gallons to raise the octain in the fall, stopped that and started using Diesel-911 in december, the fuel is cut with off road winter blend, as for the cut ratio i do not remember, should ask again.



#9 trowel OFFLINE  

trowel

    Summer.

  • Senior Member
  • -GTt Supporter-
  • Member No: 5127
  • 4,819 Thanks
  • 4,533 posts
  • Location: ma.

Posted February 07, 2014 - 07:24 AM

The best thing I have done so far is add Diesel-911 additive to my little Kubota diesel's fuel tank!! It starts a lot better now and makes a little more power too. I run it almost all year round, except the dead of summer, other than that, it gets added at every tank up.

In the spring, summer and fall cut the ultra low sulfur with non synthetic tranny fluid, it boost the octain, the Diesel-911 has the tranny fluid with out the dye in it, looked it up and confermed it, valve and injector pump chatter was reduced and gave the pistons a softer blow reducing the compression knock a little and more power, try it, you will like it and it lubricates the injector pump and injectors.

The ratio i use is 1/4 to 1/2 of a quart to 300 gallons or so. With a 2 gallon tank i use the cap from a Honda SAE 30 1 quart oil bottle.



#10 trowel OFFLINE  

trowel

    Summer.

  • Senior Member
  • -GTt Supporter-
  • Member No: 5127
  • 4,819 Thanks
  • 4,533 posts
  • Location: ma.

Posted February 07, 2014 - 07:32 AM

The thing that worries me is if the injector in the Ford has a sealing washer, wonder if the washer if it has it is squashed to the point it is alowing blow by ?

The injectors in this is adjustible so i can adjust the PSI.

Here are some of the specs, take a look at this, if any ideas pop let me know ?

http://www.google.co...7,d.cGU&cad=rja

 

Has always been a very good tractor, lots of power/torque in a small package.



#11 trowel OFFLINE  

trowel

    Summer.

  • Senior Member
  • -GTt Supporter-
  • Member No: 5127
  • 4,819 Thanks
  • 4,533 posts
  • Location: ma.

Posted February 07, 2014 - 07:44 AM

Keep the ideas coming guys, anybody with experiences with Kubotas, Yanmars, Perkins, all the mini 2 cylinder water cooled diesels.

Im open to any comments and ideas.



#12 JD DANNELS OFFLINE  

JD DANNELS

    Tractorholic

  • Senior Member
  • Member No: 2011
  • 3,786 Thanks
  • 3,907 posts
  • Location: Newton.Ia

Posted February 07, 2014 - 09:10 AM

Do you guys use any additive like this ? We have our inground fuel treated with some type of additive when we get deliveries but if we have a unit that is a little fussy we'll add this too . We never know if the truck will be working at a location that there isn't a place to plug the block heaters in

 

http://www.powerservice.com/dfs/

I started using Power Service in my Diesels when I worked part time in a Truck stop many years ago. Always run it in the winter and would put some in in the summer when injectors would get to sooting a bit.  I also bought a bottle of 911 when I had the gelling about a month ago. I will use it if I am seeing signs of gelling but I usually use the White Bottle.  In 20 yrs of owning diesels that was the first time I had ever had fuel gell in the filter.

In theory the winter blended fuel should not need additive? But working in the truck stop I learned that the blend is determined by the temp at the terminal at the time the tanker is filled. If the temps take a dive of 20 degree's(as they often have this winter) is that adequate? A bottle of Power Service is supose to treat 100 gallons of fuel. So 4 oz. in a 5 gallon can(my tractor has a 5.5 gal tank) is more than adequate. Cheap insurance against standing in a wind chilled snow bank trying to get fuel gell cleared.

I also moved the Ford from the Tractor Shed (No electricity) to the garage by the house. As Skyrocket said these things have to spin to start and I can put a charger on it in the garage. Also if it is really cold(which it has been this winter here. 10 below when I left the house this morning) I will shine a heat lamp on the pump and filter for 10-15 minutes before I try to start it.  I don't have a heater on the Ford so the heat lamp seems to make a big difference. If this stuff keeps up I will put a heater on it before next winter.  


Edited by JD DANNELS, February 07, 2014 - 09:12 AM.

  • trowel said thank you

#13 FixItCharlie OFFLINE  

FixItCharlie
  • Senior Member
  • Member No: 47950
  • 357 Thanks
  • 258 posts
  • Location: Aurora,IL

Posted February 07, 2014 - 09:57 PM

I am not real familiar with the smaller diesel motor but have used a Kubota RTV at work & have found when temperature are in the single digits or below zero holding the key in the glow plug warming position a couple seconds long seems to help & after it starts let it idle for at least 5 minutes before doing anything with it. The diesel that I am more familiar with is the 7.3 liter diesel in my F350 truck. Yes many times because of driving it a few miles I will plug it in. I have a couple of times started it when temperatures were -22 & below. These times the truck had not been plug in. One thing that I know really helps in starting is I use Castrol Full Synthetic oil. With this in it the motor spins on starting almost as easily as it does in the summer. There is other Synthetic oils on the market one thing to check is make sure it has an anti foaming agent in it. I have seen some articles on using Synthetic oil in small air cooled engines, some of them even recommend it for cold weather running but most of them do not recommend it during warm weather.

 

Charlie  


  • Alc, trowel and A.C.T. have said thanks

#14 trowel OFFLINE  

trowel

    Summer.

  • Senior Member
  • -GTt Supporter-
  • Member No: 5127
  • 4,819 Thanks
  • 4,533 posts
  • Location: ma.

Posted February 08, 2014 - 07:27 AM

The crankcase oil is Kubota's multigrade 15-40 w, also use it in the Lister Petter diesels.

With the new battery and Starter it spins up the engine pretty good, still want to try the dipstick heater, see if that helps thin the oil a little more for less resistance. The tractor is kept in the barn with the hood covered with a heavy cotten rug, block heater plugged in before every storm.

I am thinking of pulling the glow plug for # 1 cylinder and checking it to, seems the storm coming on Mon/Sun has been reduced to snow showers thankfully.

Looks like i will have to pay for a service manual, it will cost a arm and a leg for it.

With the Lister Petter the glow plug is on a momentary push switch so i can hold it while cranking the engine, pops off every time.



#15 Gabriel OFFLINE  

Gabriel
  • Senior Member
  • Contributor
  • Member No: 52459
  • 1,440 Thanks
  • 1,858 posts
  • Location: East Central Indiana

Posted February 09, 2014 - 07:45 PM

What kind of tractors do you have? Any pictures? I see your talking here about a Ford. Thanks.


  • JD DANNELS and trowel have said thanks




Top