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Hydro Pumps For Fel's


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#1 Firemang OFFLINE  

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Posted November 22, 2013 - 01:06 AM

I'm building a FEL for my open side 145.  Got plans for a backhoe with it too, not sure if I'm going to do that one yet, but definately going to attempt the FEL. She's got a K301 instead of the factory 321. The plans are from PF Engineering and they suggest getting a 4 to 8 gpm pump to run the hydros.  Any suggestions on type of pump, where to mount, how to mount, etc?  I've seen some guys on youtube mount them by removing the electric PTO clutch and mating them directly to the crank, others I've seen do a belt off the PTO clutch.  Any ideas, previous experiences you guys have, and pics especially would be appreciated.  Thanks.


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#2 Alc ONLINE  

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Posted November 22, 2013 - 06:43 AM

On my PK the factory 1200 psi pump is belt driven not sure of the gpm , it doesn't slip when correct tension is on it but I don't know if a single 1/2"  belt like that would be my first choice if I was going to do what your going to . Guessing they want 2000 psi for the loader and backhoe ? The electric pto have a pretty wide belt, maybe you use that to drive the pump ? Be nice in the winter to start the engine before engaging the pump . Wonder if a chain driven pump was ever used ? You wouldn't have so much side stress on the pump nor engine .  Can't wait to see what others suggest



#3 skyrydr2 OFFLINE  

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Posted November 22, 2013 - 07:35 AM

You have a plethora of options and your imagination is the limit here. Personally my pump of choice would be a vein pump, then a gear pump. Either will work perfectly, with the pto clutch, but if you decide to run it direct with no means to disengage, then the vein pump would be my first choice.
Chain drive for a pump has higher side loads when running than belts, but none or darned near it, when off.
6-8 gpm is plenty of fluid for any app except a woodsplitter for production.
Those plans and specs are right on and very effective.
Remember to take plenty of pics for us here, as we love photos!!
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#4 Cvans ONLINE  

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Posted November 22, 2013 - 11:22 AM

I just purchased a new pump from the Surplus Center for mine. I kept blowing the seal on the old pump. Turns out the old pump was too big for the reservoir and it was cavitaiting. Learned something new. This is the pump. It is a lttle slower  but works fine and so far the seal has not been a problem. I was told that you do not want the capacity of your pump in gpm to exceed  the reservoir capacity. If your reservoir holds 2 gals. your pump should not pump more than 2 gallons per minutes.

http://www.surplusce...keywords=9-7765


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#5 Alc ONLINE  

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Posted November 22, 2013 - 12:01 PM

Keith was wondering why the side load would be more with a chain ? I would have thought you wouldn't have needed as much tension or very little on a chain but a belt would have to be tight to keep from slipping , not that I can remember seeing a chain driven pump and maybe that's why lol


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#6 Cvans ONLINE  

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Posted November 22, 2013 - 01:16 PM

 

 

I would have thought you wouldn't have needed as much tension 

I would have thought the same thing. Doesn't take much of a tensioner on the slack side of a chain to keep things running properly. The tension on a belt can be very high. 

I'm running my pump directly off of the PTO for the deck which is not used any more. 


Edited by Cvans, November 22, 2013 - 01:17 PM.


#7 jay nesbitt OFFLINE  

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Posted November 22, 2013 - 01:40 PM

Well, as an engineer and equipment designer, I can't agree with the statement of the chain requiring more sideload, all other things being equal.  As stated above, it does not require significant tensioning. The forces are additive (or to use a fancy word superimposed). A chain drives by interference; a belt by friction; the required belt tension equals initial side load which is then added to the  sideload (torque) required to turn the pump. Both belts and chains transmit power via tension, but the tension in the belt must be greater (to produce the friction at the pulley) than the tension in the chain. 

 

By the way, I might be interested in that oversized pump , if its for sale!

 

thanks,

Jay


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#8 Cvans ONLINE  

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Posted November 22, 2013 - 02:13 PM

I was a plant engineer for 31 years and that's what I based my thoughts on. 

 

 

 

By the way, I might be interested in that oversized pump , if its for sale!

It's a Cessna pump and looks very similar to the one the attachment photo. It worked fine and didn't seem to have any other problems but the seal. 7/16" shaft. Think the fittings were 1/2" and 3/8" female pipe thread. 

$35.00 + shipping. 

P.M. me if your interested if your interested and I'll check the specs. and send photos.

Thanks



#9 Firemang OFFLINE  

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Posted November 22, 2013 - 02:54 PM

Ok, I think belt driven would be easiest for me, coming right off the PTO and over to a mount for the pump.  I actually am thinking about using the mount that held the rear PTO shaft that these Ford's used for rear implements since I'm not planning on using mine since I cant find the tiller for it.  Can anyone send me some pics if you've done one of these of how you mounted it?  Thanks.



#10 Alc ONLINE  

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Posted November 22, 2013 - 06:53 PM

Figures , you have the Ford PTO shaft and my friend Joe was looking for one because I think he has a tiller and no shaft lol 



#11 skyrydr2 OFFLINE  

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Posted November 23, 2013 - 04:16 AM

Belt tension keeps bearings loaded all the time,not bad for the bearing. The chain will"cog" and will not slip or stretch like a belt. This lack of cushioning kills pumps. Ever see a pump " wrap up" under pressure? With chain drive ? I'm not standing around it that's for sure...
Besides its noisy too.




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