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Tips For Stock Garden Tractors At The Pulls


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#31 lesmeister OFFLINE  

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Posted November 18, 2013 - 10:32 PM

Doug, sounds like a very interesting setup. Did you design and build the tractor? Hitch height will definitely help plant the rear tires, the rules of my local organization say 13 inch on the hitch height. Hope this helps, if I can be of any more help just let me know
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#32 Dieselcubmike OFFLINE  

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Posted November 18, 2013 - 10:47 PM

Hopefully you've read and understood what we all have to offer with this and realize there's a lot going on with pulling. Hopefully you can turn it into a hobby one day :thumbs:


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#33 ColoRetiree OFFLINE  

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Posted November 19, 2013 - 09:30 PM

...

Second, go with more ground contact. A larger diameter tire and wider will give more ground contact.

..

 

I also am trying to learn and I'm having a tough time seeing how a larger contact patch would be an advantage. Especially on a hard packed track, it seems to me it would spread the load out and reduce the ability of the lugs to dig into the track. Can someone straighten me out on this?


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#34 MH81 ONLINE  

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Posted November 19, 2013 - 09:36 PM

the more surface area, the more bite.  It's why they use racing slicks instead of regular tires and why wider and/or bigger tires are on all the pulling farm tractors.

 

Std sizing is very good for a variety of environmental situations.... but on a track, you dont want to "dig" necessarilly, you want to transfer the power to the ground without spinning.  There are some track conditions where guys will put on turf tires and do better.


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#35 DH1 ONLINE  

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Posted November 19, 2013 - 10:06 PM

Doug, sounds like a very interesting setup. Did you design and build the tractor? Hitch height will definitely help plant the rear tires, the rules of my local organization say 13 inch on the hitch height. Hope this helps, if I can be of any more help just let me know

 

ET2 is a Massey MF10 converted to Battery Electric drive, it's motor has a 2hp rating.

A couple pictures of it that day.

post-802-0-82799800-1384651138.jpg post-802-0-17176600-1384651167.jpg

 

And the 2 winners

post-805-0-37329000-1384887355.jpg post-805-0-56983900-1384887363.jpg


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#36 lesmeister OFFLINE  

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Posted November 19, 2013 - 10:06 PM

The guys that pull modified farm tractors also use tires like c-pecs or puller 2000's because the height of the lugs is less than a standard farm Tire. With the wheel speed and rpm that they turn the lugs would probably pull apart from the Tire. The biggest reason they use a tire like c-pecs or similar tires is they don't don't want to dig anymore than necessary because they will loose hitch height and also to keep from putting any more dirt in front of the sled than they have to and still get traction. As a lot of the members have already posted, the more tire surface you can put on the ground = more traction and more power you can hook to the track. Hopefully this will help
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#37 lesmeister OFFLINE  

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Posted November 19, 2013 - 10:20 PM

Doug, that is a nice looking machine. Myself I prefer to have the weight in the back of the tractor on the tractor itself, I have used wheel weights in the past because I had no choice. I have since made weights that I can hang in different places and different Heights on the frame to get better weight distribution. I think raising the hitch height will also help a bunch.
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#38 ColoRetiree OFFLINE  

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Posted November 19, 2013 - 10:53 PM

The guys that pull modified farm tractors also use tires like c-pecs or puller 2000's because the height of the lugs is less than a standard farm Tire. With the wheel speed and rpm that they turn the lugs would probably pull apart from the Tire. The biggest reason they use a tire like c-pecs or similar tires is they don't don't want to dig anymore than necessary because they will loose hitch height and also to keep from putting any more dirt in front of the sled than they have to and still get traction. As a lot of the members have already posted, the more tire surface you can put on the ground = more traction and more power you can hook to the track. Hopefully this will help

 

I understand your reasoning on the modified's with their high tire speeds. Makes sense to me.  But for low power Garden Tractors that don't want to spin their tires, I'm still hung up on the basic "more tire surface equals more traction". Being from snow country,  I'm comparing it to snow tires where a smaller contact patch works much better than a large, over sized contact patch. You can put more power to the ground (snow) without slipping due to the higher ground load per square inch of the smaller contact patch. 

 

Now  your "loss of hitch height" argument may be what I'm over looking.  Just thinking out loud, allowing the tread bars to dig in seems like the way to go, but you would also lose the weight transferred from the sled due to the lower hitch height. . . You may just have solved my problem.  Thanks! :rocker2:

 

On edit, that would also explain why you would want your front tires  just barely off the ground instead of carrying them 6 inches in the air. Thanks again!!!

 

 Tom


Edited by ColoRetiree, November 19, 2013 - 10:59 PM.

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#39 superspeedex OFFLINE  

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Posted November 19, 2013 - 11:09 PM

what about length back from the center of the rear axle because my speedex i can hook probably 5 inches away from center of axle or probaly 12 same goes with the cubs if you hook of the hitch or the back of the brinly hitch.


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#40 AVB OFFLINE  

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Posted November 19, 2013 - 11:28 PM

I understand your reasoning on the modified's with their high tire speeds. Makes sense to me.  But for low power Garden Tractors that don't want to spin their tires, I'm still hung up on the basic "more tire surface equals more traction". Being from snow country,  I'm comparing it to snow tires where a smaller contact patch works much better than a large, over sized contact patch. You can put more power to the ground (snow) without slipping due to the higher ground load per square inch of the smaller contact patch. 

 

Snow and prepped dirt don't have a lot in common. With snow the narrow tires help to dig down to solid ground. With a dirt track there may not be a hard bottom. You will just dig down until  you bottom out.


Edited by AVB, November 19, 2013 - 11:28 PM.

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#41 Dieselcubmike OFFLINE  

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Posted November 19, 2013 - 11:56 PM

On my vogel tires I have a full inch lug. They work great on loose dirt tracks and sand tracks as well because they act like paddles. One of the reasons the big tractors run low profile tires are for higher wheel speed and faster launches. They don't need to dig in as much since they are already close to 10,00lbs so they look for wheel speed to carry them further. Most of the garden pulling tires are mostly 5/8 lug with some being a bit smaller but my Vogel 09's are 3/4 from the factory I just ended up having them cut back to an inch because I seem to do better with the bigger lugs but the downside is, I have a bigger chance of breaking those heavy duty axles and ring gear and all that. Now with the wider contact patch. The bigger the tire, the bigger the footprint which is what you want in pulling. Bigger footprint means more digging power and more grip.


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#42 lesmeister OFFLINE  

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Posted November 20, 2013 - 09:20 AM

Tom, you may be correct with the narrow tire in snow, I do not use mine in a lot of snow. If it gets to deep my neighbor pushes my drive with his truck and snow plow. I think on a pulling track the narrow tires would be a disadvantage.
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#43 Dieselcubmike OFFLINE  

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Posted November 20, 2013 - 01:03 PM

The bigger footprint you can put down the more traction youll have. Also the type of tire your running also has a big say in it as well.


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#44 OldBuzzard ONLINE  

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Posted November 20, 2013 - 01:18 PM

On edit, that would also explain why you would want your front tires  just barely off the ground instead of carrying them 6 inches in the air. Thanks again!!!

 

 Tom

 

Another advantage for not having the front end up off the ground would be for steering.

 

In most cases, going off track is a disqualification.

 

In the pics that Doug posted above, the tractor in the bottom left with the wheels way off the ground went off track at least two times, and on one occasion had the sled 1/2 way off the track.  That would have DQed him in most pulls, but since this was just a 'Fun Pull" that wasn't in effect.

 

With the Bolens on the bottom right, the wheels never left the ground.  That gave me enough steering to bring the sled back to the center of the track for the next round.  Looking at that pic closer, I'm pretty sure that it was taken before the last two rounds and before I raised the hitch a bit.  Even after raising the hitch and with the front just BARELY touching the ground, I had just enough steering to center the sled on the track.

 

It was fun to see that 'pro puller' take off like that, but I cringed every time he stopped as the front end just slammed down on the ground.  That has to cause a lot of stress on the whole tractor. Keeping the wheels close to, or on the ground, eliminates that.


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#45 Dieselcubmike OFFLINE  

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Posted November 21, 2013 - 12:24 AM

Yes it does which is why in the NQS rules there is a certain high the wheelie wheels has to be off the ground. I think its either 6-8 inches off the ground. The diesel seems to have his up too high and as a result every time it slams he has the chance to break his front spindles off which I have seen before. And if you look at the pro stock farm tractors you see curved tubing which looks like snow skis. Those are there in case the tractor ever slams down and breaks a wheel off, those are there to help cushion the impact.


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