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Lgt 165 Repower **Updated with crawler conversion**


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#241 Chopperhed OFFLINE  

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Posted June 23, 2015 - 05:07 PM

You are putting a lot more load on things with the tracks. And that is a limited slip axle!

Actually, the loads have changed, but I'm not sure if there are more.

 

All the weight is supported by the rail, there is no weight load on the axles. The only loads on the axles are fore and aft directly as the sprocket takes up load the tracks.

 

The actual drive sprocket diameter is roughly 1/2 of the original tire diameter. From what I've seen the torque loads on the axle haven't changed much. The ground speed is roughly 1/2 half that of a wheeled tractor. There is extra drag from the tracks that has to be factored in, but I figure the reduced torque load from the 1/2 wheel speed should compensate for that. Basically all I did was change a pulley drive (wheels) to a chain drive (tracks) with 1/2 the diameter of a drive sprocket.

 

Not having a stock tractor to pull against, I can't say for sure..


Edited by Chopperhed, June 23, 2015 - 05:08 PM.

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#242 KennyP OFFLINE  

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Posted June 23, 2015 - 06:01 PM

I think the load I am talking about is the difference between a rolling tire and the tracks. A tire will roll pretty easily, the tracks take more to get them rolling. May be outside my knowledge, though.


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#243 propane1 ONLINE  

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Posted June 23, 2015 - 08:55 PM

Some difference to is , more load to turn. One track is moving, while the other is stopped, so it takes more effort to twist the non moving track to make it turn. You don't have forward in one track and reverse in the other track at the same time to make it turn easier. And more effort to move the tracks from friction of all the moving parts compared to a wheel. But a lot more traction, than a wheeled tractor. Noel. Just commenting, may not have any thing to do with what you guys are talking about.
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#244 KennyP OFFLINE  

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Posted June 24, 2015 - 05:09 AM

Some difference to is , more load to turn. One track is moving, while the other is stopped, so it takes more effort to twist the non moving track to make it turn. You don't have forward in one track and reverse in the other track at the same time to make it turn easier. And more effort to move the tracks from friction of all the moving parts compared to a wheel. But a lot more traction, than a wheeled tractor. Noel. Just commenting, may not have any thing to do with what you guys are talking about.

Maybe 'load' is not the right word to use. But, with the limited slip rear, stopping one track to turn could be hard to do. You are trying to make one 'wheel' spin when the transaxle was designed to keep that to a minimum.


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#245 Sprint 6 OFFLINE  

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Posted June 24, 2015 - 07:32 AM

You will probably find a more powerful engine will help with the turning issue.  Using wheel brakes to make it turn makes the outside wheel speed up, like on a farm tractor.  In a tracked situation, this will put an enormous load on the engine, hydro, and trans.  This is why bulldozers and tanks need to power up in a turn.  Figuring in the limited slip, and it will be an even higher load.  Would it be possible to defeat the limited slip part of the diff when you replace the bearings?  Cool crawler, though.  Wish I had the space, time, and money to build something as cool as that.  Mostly just money.


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#246 Chopperhed OFFLINE  

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Posted June 24, 2015 - 12:06 PM

You will probably find a more powerful engine will help with the turning issue.  Using wheel brakes to make it turn makes the outside wheel speed up, like on a farm tractor.  In a tracked situation, this will put an enormous load on the engine, hydro, and trans.  This is why bulldozers and tanks need to power up in a turn.  Figuring in the limited slip, and it will be an even higher load.  Would it be possible to defeat the limited slip part of the diff when you replace the bearings?  Cool crawler, though.  Wish I had the space, time, and money to build something as cool as that.  Mostly just money.

I suspect that the gears are torquing out of alignment when I try to turn, sometimes it turns nice, and sometimes it won't. I'm investigating the internals of the differential, but I won't know for sure till I take one apart. It really doesn't like to turn from a stop, but if moving it's easier. My problem now is I don't have the space to really play with it.

 

For now, however, one of the calipers locked up and when I went to reverse, it broke the mounting bracket. Looks like I'm splitting a track this afternoon.


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#247 Chopperhed OFFLINE  

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Posted June 24, 2015 - 03:07 PM

The adventure continues.

 

Got the broken caliper bracket out, but still have to split the track and pull the sprocket to weld it back in.

 

Then I'll do the other side as well, just to make sure.

 

It will take a few days.

 

On a side note, the arm on the caliper was twisted from me pulling on it so hard. I was studying the Peerless service manual and according to it, the breakaway torque on the Duo-Trak system is 50-70 lbs/ft. It should take very little to get the diff to unlock. I suspect that the left side gears or bearings are piled up. It works so nice on the other side.


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#248 propane1 ONLINE  

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Posted June 24, 2015 - 08:09 PM

Keep at it, I am sure you get it going the way you want. Noel.
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#249 Chopperhed OFFLINE  

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Posted June 24, 2015 - 08:12 PM

Keep at it, I am sure you get it going the way you want. Noel.

jeez, I can't quit now, I may pause for a bit to get some other stuff taken care of, and I want to change the calipers to hydraulic, but the trans issue is bugging me the most.


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#250 FixItCharlie ONLINE  

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Posted June 24, 2015 - 08:22 PM

One thought on steering with rear axle. Looking the Parts Manual the LGT 195 looks to use the same rear axle. Axle tubes are different because they have the mounting brackets for drum brakes. This uses split brakes to help with steering.

 

Charlie


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#251 Chopperhed OFFLINE  

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Posted June 24, 2015 - 08:27 PM

One thought on steering with rear axle. Looking the Parts Manual the LGT 195 looks to use the same rear axle. Axle tubes are different because they have the mounting brackets for drum brakes. This uses split brakes to help with steering.

 

Charlie

That's an option I'm willing to consider.


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#252 skyrydr2 OFFLINE  

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Posted June 25, 2015 - 07:07 AM

The 195 does NOT use split brakes for steering, it only has 1 pedal for brakes, so that is not good, what he needs is a full open diff with bevel gears this way there is not such a speed difference when stopping one side.
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#253 Chopperhed OFFLINE  

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Posted June 26, 2015 - 11:31 AM

I split the left side track, and with the brake removed,I can turn the axle forward by hand, but I can hardly move it in reverse and there is some ugly noise coming from it. From what I remeber last time I had the right side track off, the right side sprocket turned both ways fairly easily.


Edited by Chopperhed, June 26, 2015 - 11:32 AM.

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#254 Cvans ONLINE  

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Posted June 26, 2015 - 09:56 PM

I split the left side track, and with the brake removed,I can turn the axle forward by hand, but I can hardly move it in reverse and there is some ugly noise coming from it. 

 

This doesn't sound good. Have you been drag racing the family car again??????


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#255 Chopperhed OFFLINE  

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Posted June 26, 2015 - 10:44 PM

This doesn't sound good. Have you been drag racing the family car again??????

just the unfortunate results from buying a 40 year old chassis sight unseen, and not doing thorough enough tests. I did run tests on it when I got it, as much as I could. I should have torn it down then to do the rebuild, but I got wound up in the project.

 

Funny thing is the "repower " part is a complete success. If I put the steering gear and tires back on it would be a nice tractor to use, but that's not good enough for me.

 

From what I've seen in the design of the Peerless planetary differential, there is nothing, ( assuming everything is working properly) that should make it an issue with what I've done, except the diff is worn out.. Even in the "locking" version, the breakaway torque is 50-70 lbs/feet. The transaxle is designed to output 1200 lbs/feet at the axles.


Edited by Chopperhed, June 26, 2015 - 10:51 PM.

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