Jump to content

Nominations for Tractor of the Month
Garden Tractors and Parts on eBay



Photo
- - - - -

Ariens S-14H Keep Dying When Engaging Pto


  • Please log in to reply
32 replies to this topic

#16 pvk OFFLINE  

pvk

    New Member

  • Member
  • Member No: 7944
  • 4 Thanks
  • 20 posts
  • Location: New Hampshire

Posted July 16, 2013 - 12:48 AM

Welcome to GTTalk!

 

If everything is right, with an electric clutch, you should hear it pop in and out with the engine off, and everything hooked up right as you pull the switch.

 

I imagine you have a bad switch or wire somewhere.  For test purposes, there is no reason why you can't jump the seat switch (not to leave it that way, of course) and override that for a few minutes while you are testing. 

 

Ben W.

I think if I reversed the pto wire connector around, I hear the pto engaging constantly, once I flip it back I don't hear anything clicking...from what I remember, more to come tonight when I test it again



#17 pvk OFFLINE  

pvk

    New Member

  • Member
  • Member No: 7944
  • 4 Thanks
  • 20 posts
  • Location: New Hampshire

Posted July 16, 2013 - 12:49 AM

Welcome to the forum! Just a shot in the dark, but are you sure you have the correct ignition switch?

Thanks for including the wiring diagram. I agree that the black wire feeds the PTO. Do the lights work okay?

It looks original, maybe a $6 ignition issue?



#18 pvk OFFLINE  

pvk

    New Member

  • Member
  • Member No: 7944
  • 4 Thanks
  • 20 posts
  • Location: New Hampshire

Posted July 16, 2013 - 12:51 AM

I was going to suggest 2 things. Electrically I would test to see if the 12volts at the coil is still present when the PTO switch is pulled out. That will tell you if the power to the coil is being interupted. Mechanically I would disconnect the load from the PTO to see if that's the issue. Doing these 2 things, which have already been suggested will go a long way towards finding the problem. It's hard to tell what exactly is going on in the diagram without knowing exactly how the ignition switch functions.

Hi JDBrian, I do have everything disconnected from the pto currently, no load, just the belts on the pto currently. Thanks for the idea's, keep em coming please! How would I test 12v coming from the coil? red on center pole, the black to ground?


Edited by pvk, July 16, 2013 - 12:52 AM.


#19 pvk OFFLINE  

pvk

    New Member

  • Member
  • Member No: 7944
  • 4 Thanks
  • 20 posts
  • Location: New Hampshire

Posted July 16, 2013 - 12:53 AM

Welcome to GTT. I'd take the belt off the PTO and then see what happens. I've had similar problems occasionally  and each time it was a frozen bearing on the attachment. Good Luck, Rick

I will loosen the pto pulley and remove the belts to see if the bearings are shot. I have lots of work to do tonight then!



#20 pvk OFFLINE  

pvk

    New Member

  • Member
  • Member No: 7944
  • 4 Thanks
  • 20 posts
  • Location: New Hampshire

Posted July 16, 2013 - 01:04 AM

that 12v is only for the starter solenoid

You'll also need 12v on the black wire at 6amp circuit breaker with the key in the run position for the clutch to work

neither of which should have anything to do with killing the engine, unless the PTO clutch is shorted to ground and then it should just trip the 6amp circuit breaker, or unless the PTO shaft is locked up then I'd guess you would smell and hear some smoked squealing belts.

 

unplug the PTO clutch, one wire connector near the front left of the engine, with the key in the run position and the PTO switch engaged/pulled is there 12v on the blue wire going to the coil?

I will check that tonight also. Thanks for the troubleshooting help.



#21 pvk OFFLINE  

pvk

    New Member

  • Member
  • Member No: 7944
  • 4 Thanks
  • 20 posts
  • Location: New Hampshire

Posted July 16, 2013 - 01:05 AM

It looks original, maybe a $6 ignition issue? I will take a picture if that helps.



#22 JDBrian OFFLINE  

JDBrian

    Super Moderator

  • Super Moderator
  • Staff
  • -GTt Supporter-
  • Contributor
  • Member No: 2507
  • 9,574 Thanks
  • 14,136 posts
  • Location: Hubley, Nova Scotia - Canada

Posted July 16, 2013 - 10:15 AM

Hi JDBrian, I do have everything disconnected from the pto currently, no load, just the belts on the pto currently. Thanks for the idea's, keep em coming please! How would I test 12v coming from the coil? red on center pole, the black to ground?

 

+12 volts should come from the ignition switch to the terminal on the coil. The second coil terminal goes to the points/condenser. I'm not talking about the High voltage lead that goes to the spark plug.  So put the + lead of your voltmeter on the coil terminal with the wire from the ignition and the - to the battery -. With the key on you should have 12volts. If it drops when you engage the PTO you have a problem in the wiring somewhere. I'm assuming that your battery and charging system are working properly.


  • pvk said thank you

#23 pvk OFFLINE  

pvk

    New Member

  • Member
  • Member No: 7944
  • 4 Thanks
  • 20 posts
  • Location: New Hampshire

Posted July 16, 2013 - 10:25 AM

+12 volts should come from the ignition switch to the terminal on the coil. The second coil terminal goes to the points/condenser. I'm not talking about the High voltage lead that goes to the spark plug.  So put the + lead of your voltmeter on the coil terminal with the wire from the ignition and the - to the battery -. With the key on you should have 12volts. If it drops when you engage the PTO you have a problem in the wiring somewhere. I'm assuming that your battery and charging system are working properly.

 

New battery installed last month, 11.69 battery voltage from what I remember,



#24 pvk OFFLINE  

pvk

    New Member

  • Member
  • Member No: 7944
  • 4 Thanks
  • 20 posts
  • Location: New Hampshire

Posted July 18, 2013 - 08:46 PM

 

+12 volts should come from the ignition switch to the terminal on the coil. The second coil terminal goes to the points/condenser. I'm not talking about the High voltage lead that goes to the spark plug.  So put the + lead of your voltmeter on the coil terminal with the wire from the ignition and the - to the battery -. With the key on you should have 12volts. If it drops when you engage the PTO you have a problem in the wiring somewhere. I'm assuming that your battery and charging system are working properly.

 

New battery installed last month, 11.69 battery voltage from what I remember,

 

Sorry for taking so long to get back to this forum. I haven't been able to get much done, but hopefully this weekend will pan out some results. The one thing I did quickly was take the plastic wire connector on the pto switch and do a 180 degree turn on it, then I plugged it back into the pto switch. The pto was clicking when I turned the key to on and clicked off when turning the key off, but the tractor didn't want to turn over. I reversed the cables back 180 degree's again and the tractor kicked on, but no action from the pto now, no clicking, not a peep.

 

Going to have to take a look at the wiring diagram again to determine which way this pto switch need to be wired up.  Thanks all, hope to update you soon.

 

--pvk



#25 JDBrian OFFLINE  

JDBrian

    Super Moderator

  • Super Moderator
  • Staff
  • -GTt Supporter-
  • Contributor
  • Member No: 2507
  • 9,574 Thanks
  • 14,136 posts
  • Location: Hubley, Nova Scotia - Canada

Posted July 19, 2013 - 03:12 PM

11.69 is a bit low for a new battery. It may not be being charged properly. What is more important is the voltage when you load it! 



#26 pvk OFFLINE  

pvk

    New Member

  • Member
  • Member No: 7944
  • 4 Thanks
  • 20 posts
  • Location: New Hampshire

Posted July 21, 2013 - 08:17 PM

It looks original, maybe a $6 ignition issue?

Well, after running some more diags, I finally took out the ignition on the s14-h and this is what it looks like and the ignition plastic wire connection looks even worse!  I tried to start the tractor and it was not even turning over anymore, I checked the battery 12.27v, and the starter solenoid which is new had 12.2v running to it. Before I took the ignition wiring off the ignition, the tractor was turning over and starting, but after I removed it....kaput, nothing.

 

The pictures show the ignition and the ignition cables/plastic holder that is somewhat melted, now I need a new ignition before I continue, I don't know what to do about the plastic ignition wire connector now...any idea's if this is still available from ariens, or do I have to start splicing wires now?

Attached Thumbnails

  • P7210277.JPG
  • P7210278.JPG
  • P7210261.JPG
  • P7210270.JPG
  • P7210267.JPG
  • P7210259.JPG
  • P7210269.JPG

Edited by pvk, July 21, 2013 - 08:21 PM.


#27 pvk OFFLINE  

pvk

    New Member

  • Member
  • Member No: 7944
  • 4 Thanks
  • 20 posts
  • Location: New Hampshire

Posted July 21, 2013 - 08:23 PM

 

+12 volts should come from the ignition switch to the terminal on the coil. The second coil terminal goes to the points/condenser. I'm not talking about the High voltage lead that goes to the spark plug.  So put the + lead of your voltmeter on the coil terminal with the wire from the ignition and the - to the battery -. With the key on you should have 12volts. If it drops when you engage the PTO you have a problem in the wiring somewhere. I'm assuming that your battery and charging system are working properly.

 

New battery installed last month, 11.69 battery voltage from what I remember,

 

Checked the battery today, 12.27v



#28 pvk OFFLINE  

pvk

    New Member

  • Member
  • Member No: 7944
  • 4 Thanks
  • 20 posts
  • Location: New Hampshire

Posted July 21, 2013 - 08:25 PM

Hi JDBrian, I do have everything disconnected from the pto currently, no load, just the belts on the pto currently. Thanks for the idea's, keep em coming please! How would I test 12v coming from the coil? red on center pole, the black to ground?

 

I tested the coil, and I was getting 12.07v 12.1v to the + side and no voltage drop when engaging the pto.



#29 pvk OFFLINE  

pvk

    New Member

  • Member
  • Member No: 7944
  • 4 Thanks
  • 20 posts
  • Location: New Hampshire

Posted July 21, 2013 - 08:28 PM

More pictures

Attached Thumbnails

  • P7210268.JPG
  • P7210260.JPG


#30 HowardsMF155 ONLINE  

HowardsMF155

    Tractorholic

  • Senior Member
  • Member No: 4243
  • 2,699 Thanks
  • 2,916 posts
  • Location: Central NC

Posted July 21, 2013 - 08:32 PM

From the looks of the harness, I'd say that when the PTO engaged, it was killing the voltage level from the switch to the coil due to poor connections.  A new wiring harness, or you could just put individual spade connectors on, and a new switch, and you should be good to go.


  • pvk said thank you




Top