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Twostep's Fel Build


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#1 twostep OFFLINE  

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Posted July 08, 2013 - 11:34 PM

Here are some sketches I have worked up. This is the third revision and it gives me the required below grade depth with the best height. I plan to use Arms: 2 x 3 x 3/16", Uprights: 2 x 5 (or 6) x 1/4".

 

Fixed points: GT (GT14), Cylinders 2.25x19x1.25 (26"/45" eye to eye), two cylinders for lift and one for curl/roll.

 

Goals: #1; be able to dump over the sides of my car hauler trailer fenders, #2; 4" below grade with 4" of roll, #3; bucket to be as close to the GT as possible.

 

Other than the limitations listed above nothing is fixed so if you've worked or built one, please give me some insight/advice. 

 

FEL Max.jpg FEL trailer dump.jpg


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#2 KennyP ONLINE  

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Posted July 09, 2013 - 03:33 AM

Nice drawings. Sounds good to me.



#3 skyrydr2 ONLINE  

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Posted July 09, 2013 - 04:44 AM

Remember you want a little bit of reach when the bucket is raised fully so you can dump the load away from the tractor( close to the middle of your trailer).
Also " curl back" is everything to a loader, this is " breakout force" You want . fill your bucket in a sand pile by curling back NOT by lifting, it takes traction away . So your curling needs to be strong. Just some more food for thought ;-)
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#4 Alc ONLINE  

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Posted July 09, 2013 - 05:39 AM

Looks like it should work nicer then what's on my PK , the bucket cyl on mine are short so my bucket doesn't curl back and  dump as good as yours looks to be . I have to raise the loader higher then I want at times to keep material in the bucket and then when won't dump as good as it should .Good luck !



#5 JD DANNELS OFFLINE  

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Posted July 09, 2013 - 07:56 AM

That looks pretty good to me. The curl back that Al mentions, is good with one exception I see. You might want to extend the top of the bucket 6-8 inches as a guard for spill out.  I'm thinking if your not on your toes you could be dumping a load in your lap?


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#6 twostep OFFLINE  

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Posted July 09, 2013 - 07:58 AM

Remember you want a little bit of reach when the bucket is raised fully so you can dump the load away from the tractor... Also " curl back" is everything...

 

Thank you, I think we PM'd about another loader idea I had. I also read through all of your tips on an MTF FEL build.

 

First, my concern with moving the bucket too far away from the GT is that it would put more leverage on the front axle. With this design I've got probably better than 2' from the tip of the bucket (at full dump) to the front of my grille.

 

Second, with the arms lowered completely the bucket should be about 4" below grade and I've got probably 6" of lift at the front of the bucket... which means at grade the bucket would have slightly more curl back. Do you think that is enough?



#7 olcowhand ONLINE  

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Posted July 09, 2013 - 09:04 AM

Remember you want a little bit of reach when the bucket is raised fully so you can dump the load away from the tractor( close to the middle of your trailer).
Also " curl back" is everything to a loader, this is " breakout force" You want . fill your bucket in a sand pile by curling back NOT by lifting, it takes traction away . So your curling needs to be strong. Just some more food for thought ;-)

 

Weaker "curl back" was why I switched from a single tilt cylinder to a 2 cylinder curl.  I didn't have enough curl force being I have my pressure set to only 800 to 900psi.  With 2 & 1/2" lift cylinders, I felt it best to keep my pressures low to prevent my being able to lift too much weight, but it will still lift waaay more than safe.  

  My bucket bottoms level to grade, as I wanted higher lift, and I also do digging with it, and I've never seen a need for any lower a setting.


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#8 twostep OFFLINE  

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Posted July 09, 2013 - 09:22 AM

Thanks Daniel

 

It was late last night when I finally got to sketching this up (my excuse) but I can already see that if I stick with a single bucket cylinder that I will have to redesign the cylinder to arm mounting location... Right now it's in my grille. :toilethead:

 

I'm pretty happy with the looks of it though, proportions seem right.



#9 Texas Deere and Horse OFFLINE  

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Posted July 09, 2013 - 09:24 AM

Our Cat 936 sits level with the ground, to dig we just tilt the bucket down some. I see no reason to build the loader to sit level below grade. :thumbs:  But Bobby, it's your build, so do as you see fit. :D



#10 Cvans ONLINE  

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Posted July 09, 2013 - 09:46 AM

My big loader came with a design flaw that I have to fix. When the loader is all the way up the bucket will not tilt down far enough to completely empty it's load. That is going to get fixed with longer cylinders shortly. You might want to check this on your design. Your drawings look nice. I wish I had your talent.



#11 JDBrian OFFLINE  

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Posted July 09, 2013 - 10:36 AM

Have a look at the Kubota BX1870 tractor and loader on the Kubota site. It's probably about the size of a GT14 but heavier. That will give you some idea of the geometry they use and I think they provide detailed specs on their loaders. Any of the SCUT tractors with a loader will give you a good idea of what is a safe design. They use a high pressure ,typically 2kpsi, hydraulic pump so the cylinders are small in diameter.


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#12 skyrydr2 ONLINE  

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Posted July 09, 2013 - 11:00 AM

 Everything looks good with your drawing , but as the others mentioned ,my self included , don't  really think the 4" below grade is a nessesary . It can make a chore out of grading/scraping. Why you may ask? Well because what most likely will happen is you will curl back the bucket and ride the heel , thus wearing it out and doing way more work than needed. Its alot easier to tilt the bucket to dig than lift the front wheels off trying to dig with the wrong angle of attack on the cutting edge.

 

 And I also second a spill shield, my 1958 Ford 1841 Industrial's loader looks and works almost identical to your design, and for the most part it is dang near perfect..... except it will and has spilled dirt on the nose at full lift. (I can fill a 10 wheeler with side boards with it too)


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#13 olcowhand ONLINE  

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Posted July 09, 2013 - 11:59 AM

My big loader came with a design flaw that I have to fix. When the loader is all the way up the bucket will not tilt down far enough to completely empty it's load.  

 

I had the same issue, but I was deep into my build by then, so I opted to lose some of my curl-back of my bucket to remedy that.  I can still get plenty in my bucket even though it doesn't tilt backwards as far.  Otherwise I would have had to do a lot of cutting/changing.


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#14 twostep OFFLINE  

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Posted July 09, 2013 - 12:30 PM

At Brian's suggestion I checked out kubota's BX series loader and it's max height (at the bucket pin) is only 71"... Mine is more like 76-78".

 

The main reason I am building this is for moving some dirt and gravel around, doing a little bit of excavation work for a equipment shed I want to build, unloading manure from my flat trailer and turning compost piles... that is all. I also need to be able to load material onto my trailer from the side and I guess being able to load into my truck bed would be nice too.

 

I give all of that info because now I'm wondering if I designed it to reach TOO high... honestly I was gauging it by wanting to be able to stand under the bucket when it is at full height (which I exceeded by a few inches). I am thinking now that if I can dump the bucket over the side of my truck bed then 99.999% of the time that would be high enough. For lifting beams or something relatively light up high I can build a boom attachment.



#15 JDBrian OFFLINE  

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Posted July 09, 2013 - 03:40 PM

On my 2320 /200cx there is some over travel for digging/ maybe 3 inches. The tighter the bucket can be kept to the front wheels when at carrying height the better IMO. It helps visibility, stability and makes the tractor shorter. If you look at the max lifting capability on the small tractors like the Kubota BX and other SCUT's it's generally 4-500lbs. It's really easy to over build on that with large diameter cylinders.  A GT14 is not a heavy tractor compared to a 1400lb SCUT. The factory designs are conservative in terms of safety but still work very well. You need to size the bucket properly  A 48" wide bucket may be too wide for a GT14.






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