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Not Much Seat Time


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#1 machinist OFFLINE  

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Posted May 13, 2013 - 07:14 PM

I took both tractors out today to do some garden work.   The old, ugly 446 worked like a champ cultivating then hilling potatoes, then disking the unplanted gardens. 

The 448 was the one that got the new paint, and LOTS of new parts and rework this past winter.  Hooked it up to the tiller to work a small patch behind the house and it did fine.   For a while.   Then it vapor locked.   Again.   Repeatedly. 

It has a rebuilt carb, new fuel pump (broke the old one getting that nasty black rubber gas line off of it), new air filter, new fuel line from the tank forward, new porous bronze gas filter, new intake manifold and carb gaskets, and the gas line was rerouted farther away from hot areas, the heat shields were repaired to original condition, and the overheating muffler was replaced.   The gas line is the yellow Tygon tubing that doesn't get hard like the old black rubber stuff.  It is fastened with zip ties to keep it in place, and away from heat shields and such.   

No luck.  It still vapor locks.  I could see the gas bubbling in the line near the carb when it died.    Let it sit until it cooled off and it takes off like a new one.   Right up until you work it with that tiller and the gas boils and it dies.   Again.    I am pretty tired of this.   It doesn't do this except when I run the tiller.   I did have pretty good success with the tiller since the soil was in PERFECT condition for tilling, but of course it takes 3 or 4 passes to get a decent seed bed in this clay loam.  

I decided to heck with the tiller and drove toward the garage with it, but barely got out of the garden before it vapor locked again.   When it had cooled a while, I went to get it and it would not start.   Not even a click.   Turns out that either the detents or the neutral safety switch if bent, broken, or something, and the travel control lever wouldn't move off neutral.   Nor would the switch "make" to allow it to start.    It can't be anything very serious in there, but it IS a B!TCH to get in there to work on it.   Remove battery, drain hydraulics, remove all the wiring by the dash, take out the hydraulic tank, remove the panels, etc., etc., ad nauseum.

I got the 446 and a chain, unhooked the tiller since it was on the ground, and wife my wife steering the dead 448, I towed it to the garage door.   It is cramped quarters, so I had to put the snow blade on the 446 and pushed the 448 into the garage.   Did some digging in the gravel driveway, since the 448 has a holding valve and does not push easily, but it did go inside.   Now the tiller is down for the season, which doesn't break my heart since it isn't very useful to me anyway, but it is IN THE WAY. 

And there it will sit until next winter when I MIGHT have time to work on "Old Unreliable".   Again.   Repeatedly.   :deadhorse:  

I HATE THIS TRACTOR!!!!  :mad2:     :shoot2:


Edited by machinist, May 13, 2013 - 07:17 PM.

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#2 olcowhand ONLINE  

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Posted May 13, 2013 - 07:36 PM

Doesn't the 448 have a hi/neutral/low rear end?  They roll like the wind in neutral.


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#3 Gtractor OFFLINE  

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Posted May 13, 2013 - 08:31 PM

With that kind of trouble I'd just remove the hood to till.  If you ran a metal fuel line you could clamp old style wooden clothespins on the line to dissipate the heat. That "old school" trick really does work.


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#4 machinist OFFLINE  

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Posted May 13, 2013 - 08:55 PM

olcowhand,

Darned if it doesn't!   I had never paid any attention to that.  Makes me feel a bit stupid for not thinking of it. 

 

Gtractor,

I did the clothespin trick on the 446 a couple years ago, and clamped on some aluminum foil for a heat reflector.   It worked pretty well until I got new heat shields on it.  (They were missing.) 

 

Other possibilities suggested on another forum are:

Plugged fuel filter.   (It's only got a couple hours on it, but you never know.)

Plugged gas cap vent.  (It's old, and had no attention, so that's possible.)

Pinched gas line somewhere I can't see.

 

Something is funky under the dash, OR, I have some kind of weird hydraulic problem? The travel lever would not budge from neutral, and the safety switch apparently was not made--no power to the solenoid. However, after wife and I towed and pushed it into the garage, the lever DID move normally, although a little rough, AND it started! How dumb is that?

Might have some issue in the travel valve? But, if so, why would it not make the neutral safety switch? The lever pointer was in the right place for neutral at that time, too. Checked linkage to the travel valve and it seems okay.

No way to really know what's up here until I get the dash tower apart, and that is going to be a while due to spring work.  I had to use the 446 to move the tiller into the garage, then shuffle the tractors around to get them where they needed to be.   Had to put on the snowplow to push the 448 into place (it pushed HARD) then dismount the snowplow to get it put away.   Then put the riding mower in behind the snowplow, etc.   It took an hour  or so and I'm beat.   Too tired to think tonight.

 

EDIT TO ADD:   I just figured out the travel lever problem.  I had the parking brake locked when I was trying to get the tiller off!   No wonder the lever wouldn't move!   Duh. :wallbanging:


Edited by machinist, May 13, 2013 - 09:09 PM.


#5 John@Reliable OFFLINE  

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Posted May 13, 2013 - 08:55 PM

Somethings not right, are all the tins on motor and good air flow. You are only the *second person that I have heard this happen to, considering how long they have been around I sure others would be complaining if it was a issue. My 446 gets hot too, and the hot air that gets blown towards me sometimes is almost unbearable on a hot day, but never any locking problems.

 

* They didn't have all the tins in place.


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#6 machinist OFFLINE  

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Posted May 13, 2013 - 09:25 PM

I HAD to know, so I booted the cat off the tractor seat and took the gas cap off. Tried blowing through it, and sure enough, it was plugged up. The top hole was okay, but the plastic piece inside the cap had its' tiny hole plugged. I just ran a #60 drill bit through and it looks like the problem is solved! I can blow through it anyway.

I'll try running it tomorrow and know for sure.

John@Reliable,

I had the same problem with my 446 last year, and it WAS missing the exhaust heat shields. I made a set (copied from the other tractor) and it is doing fine now. But you can bet I'll be checking the gas cap on that one, too! The 448 that I had trouble with today has all its' heat shields. I just repaired them where some idjit had them all cut up and bent outa shape.

Thanks to a guy named Gator2 on another forum for the gas cap idea.

Edited by machinist, May 13, 2013 - 09:53 PM.


#7 Marty'70 OFFLINE  

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Posted May 14, 2013 - 09:50 AM

With that kind of trouble I'd just remove the hood to till.  If you ran a metal fuel line you could clamp old style wooden clothespins on the line to dissipate the heat. That "old school" trick really does work.

You made me laught GT.. my dad had an old ford truck ( don't knock it i love my blue ovals) that when you opened the hood it looked like someone was hiding a porcupine in there... clothespins sticking up all over the gas lines... :bigrofl:


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#8 machinist OFFLINE  

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Posted May 28, 2013 - 09:26 PM

The gas cap trick didn't fix it. See this new thread: http://gardentractor...8-cant-get-gas/




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