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Kohler K321


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#1 LTD OFFLINE  

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Posted January 22, 2013 - 08:02 PM

  This is the engine in the Cub Cadet 149 loader tractor.Ever since I got it it has started terrible. It won't turn over fast enough to start. It starts turning over then backfires out the carb. It gets worse as it gets colder. I tried to start it the other day when it was 20 degrees and it was all the starter could do to turn it over. As soon as it gets on the compression stroke, it will stall the starter for a couple secs. then it will get over the compression stroke and start it all over again.The ACR is working fine. I thought it might be timing???



#2 JDBrian OFFLINE  

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Posted January 22, 2013 - 08:35 PM

The timing is easy to set on those. If the points are in good condition you just set the gap and that gets you pretty close on the timing. A carbon buildup or a blown head gasket are 2 things that I have seen cause hard starting as well. You might want to check out your starter circuit. If you have a bad connection somewhere or a weak battery it won't get the voltage necessary to roll it over fast enough to start. 


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#3 coldone OFFLINE  

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Posted January 22, 2013 - 08:49 PM

Probably not your problem but, I had the magnet in the starter housing crack and start draging on the armature. It wouldnt hardly spin it over. Definatley not spitting back or trying to fire up.


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#4 bgkid2966 OFFLINE  

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Posted January 22, 2013 - 09:44 PM

Have you checked the points? They could be pitted. I don't know if that would cause this issue or not. Points can make engines act funny :rolling: .

 

 

 

 

Geno


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#5 larrybl OFFLINE  

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Posted January 22, 2013 - 09:47 PM

Those have a compression release on the cam shaft that keeps the exaust slightly opened till it fires. sounds like yours is not working.

Attached Thumbnails

  • acr 1.JPG
  • acr 2.JPG

Edited by larrybl, January 22, 2013 - 09:55 PM.

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#6 larrybl OFFLINE  

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Posted January 22, 2013 - 09:56 PM

Sorry for the poor pictures, the Kohler Service manual can be found in the manuals section.


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#7 WNYTractorTinkerer ONLINE  

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Posted January 22, 2013 - 10:11 PM

The timing is easy to set on those. If the points are in good condition you just set the gap and that gets you pretty close on the timing. A carbon buildup or a blown head gasket are 2 things that I have seen cause hard starting as well. You might want to check out your starter circuit. If you have a bad connection somewhere or a weak battery t won't get the voltage necessary to roll it over fast enough to start. 

Good Advice from Brian above..  

 

1-  Load test your battery 

2-  Check connections & clean if necessary.

3-  Try to rotate the engine by hand to see how easy it is to turn.  If it's hard to spin you may have tranny or engine internal issues.  (maybe the dragging magnet Coldone suggests?)

4-  Your solenoid & starter will be the next thing to look at..  

 

Just some thoughts for ya on a chilly night in WNY..


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#8 boyscout862 OFFLINE  

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Posted January 22, 2013 - 10:29 PM

Check all the easy things first. If none of that works check the valve lash. I've found some small engines with the gap down to nothing so that the valve timing was way off. You can also watch the lifters to see if the compression release is working.


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#9 LTD OFFLINE  

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Posted January 22, 2013 - 10:42 PM

Check all the easy things first. If none of that works check the valve lash. I've found some small engines with the gap down to nothing so that the valve timing was way off. You can also watch the lifters to see if the compression release is working.

  I set both the valves to specs. How can you tell if the ACR is working by the lifters?


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#10 LTD OFFLINE  

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Posted January 22, 2013 - 10:43 PM

Those have a compression release on the cam shaft that keeps the exaust slightly opened till it fires. sounds like yours is not working.

I think the ACR is working,I took the oil pan off and it looked fine.The spring was intact and still hooked up.


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#11 LTD OFFLINE  

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Posted January 22, 2013 - 10:46 PM

Good Advice from Brian above..  

 

1-  Load test your battery 

2-  Check connections & clean if necessary.

3-  Try to rotate the engine by hand to see how easy it is to turn.  If it's hard to spin you may have tranny or engine internal issues.  (maybe the dragging magnet Coldone suggests?)

4-  Your solenoid & starter will be the next thing to look at..  

 

Just some thoughts for ya on a chilly night in WNY..

I have tried a couple different batteries on it and 2 different starters also. The connections are clean on the battery. The starter solenoid could be an issue though. I have never changed it.



#12 larrybl OFFLINE  

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Posted January 22, 2013 - 11:10 PM

What size battery are you using? I had a 320CCA and it bairly would crank mine (Ford LGT 145) I switched to a 430CCA and it made a big difference. Don't think that would solve the rough running though.


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#13 WNYTractorTinkerer ONLINE  

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Posted January 23, 2013 - 12:30 AM

I have tried a couple different batteries on it and 2 different starters also. The connections are clean on the battery. The starter solenoid could be an issue though. I have never changed it.

How does the thing crank with the plug out?  Try it..  Since you were in the engine-  How did the balance (aka-grenade gears) look?  (Some engines don't have these)  They could be damaged and mucking up the works as well..  

 

Bypass the solenoid by using pliers or one side of jumper cables and directly connecting the two big terminals **when you have all safety's set and tractor in Neutral.  Give it a try but beware there will be sparks..  Also be careful not to ground your terminals to any ground!


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#14 JDBrian OFFLINE  

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Posted January 23, 2013 - 06:11 AM

Have you got a good connection from the chassis of the motor back to the battery - terminal. Sometimes that connection gets ignored or taken for granted as people concentrate on the + side of the circuit. If I remember correctly you can easily see the CR working by opening the valve cover and rolling the engine over by hand with the plug out. As you roll the engine through the compression stroke you should see the valve lifting a bit. It's been almost 2 years since I had one apart but I remember it being quite easy to see it working.


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#15 LTD OFFLINE  

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Posted January 23, 2013 - 12:20 PM

How does the thing crank with the plug out?  Try it..  Since you were in the engine-  How did the balance (aka-grenade gears) look?  (Some engines don't have these)  They could be damaged and mucking up the works as well..  

 

Bypass the solenoid by using pliers or one side of jumper cables and directly connecting the two big terminals **when you have all safety's set and tractor in Neutral.  Give it a try but beware there will be sparks..  Also be careful not to ground your terminals to any ground!

I took the grenade gears out of it when I had it apart. Didn't seem to help. I will try turning it over with the plug out today. I'll try bypassing the solenoid also.






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