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Ring On Back Of Engine Block


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#1 farmer OFFLINE  

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Posted December 11, 2012 - 07:15 PM

OK, I'm looking for answers to the age old question. Is the ring on the back of the engine where the transmission bolts up required. The reason is because I've always thought it was for aligning the bell housing but someone said tonight if it doesn't have the ring it can break the bolts off or destroy the block if its under a lot of work such as plowing.

#2 David Brown OFFLINE  

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Posted December 11, 2012 - 07:44 PM

I don't know if the bolts would break but I believe they put the ring there because it is necessary. I would think it serves several purposes such as centering the hogs head for one. I never really thought about it to be honest. I just feel that, with the price of machining, I just don't think they would have it if it wasn't needed.

#3 olcowhand OFFLINE  

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Posted December 11, 2012 - 08:00 PM

If there are no indexing pins, then a bell housing must have the ring. Perfect center is required with these type clutches.

#4 farmer OFFLINE  

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Posted December 11, 2012 - 08:21 PM

The gentleman I spoke with basically said the ring does the same thing that dowel pins do. I'm curious if its just for line up of the bell housing or would there be some kind of long term affect from having an engine without the ring.

#5 Ryan313 OFFLINE  

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Posted December 11, 2012 - 08:45 PM

Tough question, I don't think they would put it on there unless it served some type of purpose. I can't really offer much information on this.

#6 glgrumpy ONLINE  

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Posted December 11, 2012 - 09:22 PM

I'm opposite of most here. I HAVE bolted up Hog's Head w/out rings n engines. The bolt holes are same pattern on all the blocks though. Those are big 7/16 bolts and I use hardened and lock washers and have had no problems yet. I don't really WORK my tractors much, like plowing, but do pull big things around and haven't had an issue yet. I have seen and now using engines that had a ring, but was smaller in diameter than the PK ones. That was on a Jacobson sourced K engine and is in one of my PK's now.

#7 farmer OFFLINE  

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Posted December 11, 2012 - 09:49 PM

Well I was told that one person didnt use case hardened bolts and it sheered them off and another fellow did and it busted the cast in the block. If someone was to find a K361 without the ring should they be scared to use it.(not because its a k361 but because it doesn't have the ring haha)

#8 David Brown OFFLINE  

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Posted December 11, 2012 - 10:04 PM

I would hesitate because I would want to be assured it had the right shaft size. If it has the ring, everything else should be good. If it doesn't have the ring, I would worry that other things that I need may be different as well.

#9 Farmlife OFFLINE  

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Posted December 12, 2012 - 05:20 AM

If there are no indexing pins, then a bell housing must have the ring. Perfect center is required with these type clutches.

yup....I agree

#10 Alc OFFLINE  

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Posted December 12, 2012 - 11:42 AM

I've never had an engine off my belhousing on my PK's to see this ring you guys are talking about is this somthing casted on the block then machined ? Al

#11 David Brown OFFLINE  

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Posted December 12, 2012 - 12:41 PM

I've never had an engine off my belhousing on my PK's to see this ring you guys are talking about is this somthing casted on the block then machined ? Al


It's not so much a ring as it is a big boss that is machined into the block (or out of the block depending on how you look at it). Think in those terms. The hogshead seats right onto the boss which lines everything up.
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#12 Username OFFLINE  

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Posted December 12, 2012 - 02:24 PM

A flange is the term some use to describe it.Some of the older Briggs used were FB and DFB with the F meaning flange mount.I have probably had half a dozen tractors repowered without using a flange mount engine but they were that way when I got them.From what I understand on the Kohler engines used by EP,they were an off the shelf service engine with flange mount and and ball bearing mains.

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#13 farmer OFFLINE  

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Posted December 12, 2012 - 08:34 PM

I have a k361 being shipped to me as we speak with the flange, 1 1/8" shaft and the correct oil pan for 200 bucks shipped. Best of all is I haven't paid for it yet and he said if its not what I want to just keep it and pay nothing. What a stand up guy. He took it apart for shipping tonight and said it has anew piston and rod in it. He hasn't ran it though but the previous owner claimed it had been rebuilt. He bough the allis tractor for the trans but didn't want the motor because of its reputation. I'm going to get it running and it should be a direct bolt in. I'm gonna pull the head and check it first thing when I get it. This should pull my 60" deck I just got fine.
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