Jump to content

Nominations for Tractor of the Month
Garden Tractors and Parts on eBay



Photo
- - - - -

Dealing With Ultra Low Sulpher Diesel


  • Please log in to reply
13 replies to this topic

#1 OldBuzzard OFFLINE  

OldBuzzard

    Tractorholic

  • Senior Member
  • -GTt Supporter-
  • Contributor
  • Member No: 805
  • 6,481 Thanks
  • 4,633 posts
  • Location: Oberlin, OH

Posted November 23, 2012 - 03:15 PM

I've been doing some research, and I'm a bit concerned about the ULSD that we have to use now.

From what I can gather, ULSD lacks the lubrication that was present in the LSD that it replaced, and that can cause problems with fuel pumps, injectors, etc. With two of the older diesels, one being the Wisconsin/Ducati which parts are almost impossible to find, I started looking for possible solutions.

In my research I turned up this independent study/test:
http://www.dieselpla...ad.php?t=177728

Based on that study, I'm thinking of using the Opti-Lube XPD. Has anyone here used the Opti-Lube products? If so, what are your observations.

Another question I have is on very cold temps. XPD is advertised to prevent gelling dawn to -20F. That should be more than enough for my location, but let's assume that for some reason it dropped -30F and my fuel gells. Will it 'un-gell' once the temperature rises to something reasonable, or would I have to take other measures?

I'm a newb to this diesel stuff, so any advice is helpful.
  • ducky and Toolpartzman have said thanks

#2 Amigatec OFFLINE  

Amigatec

    Collector of Rusty Junk

  • Senior Member
  • -GTt Supporter-
  • Contributor
  • Member No: 5899
  • 2,023 Thanks
  • 3,172 posts
  • Location: Haskell Oklahoma

Posted November 23, 2012 - 03:21 PM

It should ungodly just fine, I've seen this happen before.

#3 8tyman8 OFFLINE  

8tyman8

    Member

  • Senior Member
  • GTt Junior
  • Member No: 5455
  • 414 Thanks
  • 731 posts
  • Location: kingston ont canada

Posted November 23, 2012 - 03:46 PM

Im just as new to Diesel to as you I have owned a karcher Diesel powered (for the burner) power-washer for a few years now and i have never seen the fuel Gel How ever my friend had a ford F350 with the 6.0 L diesel If you dont know much about that The change over for Emissions engines need to run So hot Lean and clean doing that they put all this crap on them Egr cooler cat's and Now Dpf its a filter that catches all the Soot and reburn's when clogged (called regen cycle) it using No 7 and 8 cyls firing the injectors on the Exhaust stroke Sure looks good on paper but when the filter is truly clogged it keeps doing the regen cycle and it Melts 7 and 8 pistons Not smart on fords part but back to the 6.0 L they are good motor IF set up right Good head gaskets/head bolts/injectors/Egr delete/And THE RAD CAP but he was using the howes stuff i have used that in my power washer with no troubles i also picked up some Cleen flow the howes stuff Good stuff and it will be going in the 1256D fuel tank

Attached Thumbnails

  • IMG_0596.JPG
  • IMG_0598.JPG


#4 shorty ONLINE  

shorty

    Member

  • Senior Member
  • -GTt Supporter-
  • Member No: 6172
  • 3,520 Thanks
  • 3,913 posts
  • Location: Lancaster County Pa

Posted November 23, 2012 - 03:55 PM

From my experiance once it starts warming up it will start ungelling. As in if it protected to -20 and it drops below that and gels, once it warms up past that point it should ungel on its own. They sure are a mess when they are gelled and needed.

#5 jd.rasentrac ONLINE  

jd.rasentrac

    Admirer of DEERE enjoyneering and design!

  • Senior Member
  • Contributor
  • Member No: 10327
  • 4,441 Thanks
  • 3,988 posts
  • Location: Niedervorschütz, Hessen, Deutschland

Posted November 23, 2012 - 04:12 PM

You'll get the ungelling effect also, when using petroleum, mixed in the diesel. Since several years, we have "Winterdiesel" at germany. But when I was a little boy (in the 1960s) my grandpa always mixed petroleum or benzin in the diesel when winter came. Petroleum is better, it doesn't damage the oilfilm in the cylinder.

#6 boyscout862 ONLINE  

boyscout862
  • Senior Member
  • Member No: 8923
  • 9,750 Thanks
  • 7,522 posts
  • Location: N.E. Connecticut

Posted November 23, 2012 - 04:12 PM

My Ford 2000 diesel drove part way down the driveway and died when it was about 10 degrees F years ago. The filter inside the tank was plugged with some of the thickened fuel. I put an electic heater to it for a couple of hours and got it running. Since then when its real cold and I'm going to have to plow I put a 200w heater to the fuel tank for an hour or two before I start it. I usually have a tarp over the tractor to keep heat in.

#7 JDBrian OFFLINE  

JDBrian

    Super Moderator

  • Super Moderator
  • Staff
  • -GTt Supporter-
  • Contributor
  • Member No: 2507
  • 9,574 Thanks
  • 14,136 posts
  • Location: Hubley, Nova Scotia - Canada

Posted November 23, 2012 - 05:48 PM

I always treat my diesel with a JD additive that is supposed to improve lubricity, increase cetane etc. The Opti products that I have used in the past were very highly recommended by my JD dealer and I had no issues with them. That included their 4 stroke oil, 2 stroke mix oil and gas treatment. The dealership changed hands and they no longer sell the Opti products. If they did I would still be using them. I haven't run into them any where else locally.
  • hayguy said thank you

#8 Amigatec OFFLINE  

Amigatec

    Collector of Rusty Junk

  • Senior Member
  • -GTt Supporter-
  • Contributor
  • Member No: 5899
  • 2,023 Thanks
  • 3,172 posts
  • Location: Haskell Oklahoma

Posted November 23, 2012 - 05:59 PM

Diesel fuel will collect water on its own, and with the paraffin that is in it, it will gel when cold. Most service station will switch to winter blend in the fall.

If nothing else I would probably change the fuel filter to remove any water that is in the filter.

#9 Oo-v-oO OFFLINE  

Oo-v-oO

    New Member

  • Senior Member
  • Contributor
  • Member No: 5162
  • 340 Thanks
  • 448 posts
  • Location: Live Free or Die, USA

Posted November 23, 2012 - 06:44 PM

As to the question of lubricity - mixing ashless 2-stroke motor oil with the diesel will take care of that. Be sure it is ashless, most but not all 2-stroke oil is.

I ran VW diesels for many years and they thrived on a diet of about 8 ounces of 2-stroke to a tank of diesel fuel. It is an oil that is designed to be burned, unlike 4-stroke motor oil which contains a lot of additives such as zinc which will produce a lot of ash.

For anti-gel, you want to use a product called Power Service. It comes in different grades, in white, silver, or red bottles, though not all stores will carry all varieties. White is regular strength, silver is extra strength, and the red is "Diesel 911".
Alternately, a small amount of plain old kerosene acts just fine as an anti-gel, or at higher dose to thaw gelled fuel.
Be sure to use some 2-stroke with it, as kerosene lacks lubricity. The 2-stroke oil makes up for it nicely.
  • caseguy said thank you

#10 Cat385B ONLINE  

Cat385B

    Therapy CAT

  • Senior Member
  • Contributor
  • Member No: 8002
  • 11,692 Thanks
  • 8,886 posts
  • Location: MN

Posted November 23, 2012 - 06:50 PM

I have no experience with the additive, but shop around for diesel fuel. Some pumps will be labeled #2, #1, or winter blend. You want #1.

Edited by Cat385B, November 23, 2012 - 06:51 PM.


#11 JD DANNELS OFFLINE  

JD DANNELS

    Tractorholic

  • Senior Member
  • Member No: 2011
  • 3,786 Thanks
  • 3,907 posts
  • Location: Newton.Ia

Posted November 23, 2012 - 08:03 PM

The 1500 FORD is my first diesel tractor and I just rolled up 40hrs on it since it came home.
I do not know anything about the additive you mention, but put 200,000 miles on a VW diesel Rabbit.
So for many years have been a believer in Power Service and add a few ounces to every can of diesel I bring home.
I never had a gelling problem, but there are several things I do to prevent it.
1. keep the tannk full so condensation does not allow water. 2. buy your fuel at tha truck stop that moves a high volume of fuel
(for same reason as 1) 3. Do not buy a lot of extra fuel that can sit in the can and collect moisture. 4. buy the fuel when you need it.
I worked part time in a truck stop here in Iowa(we get cold winters). Winter blends of fuel are blended based on the temp at the depot at the time a tanker is filled. This means if it is 34 degrees at the time the tank is loaded and the temp is 20 below that night, the winter blend could gel. This is the reason I always add power service to my fuel.
Another thing to consider if the fuel gels the paraffin can clog the fuel filter. If you ever get a gel its a good idea to have a spare filter to change. It was 60 degrees yesterday and 28 when I fired up the Ford this morning, a diesel does not have to be a problem if you just take a few precautions in cold weather.

Edited by JD DANNELS, November 23, 2012 - 08:12 PM.


#12 JD DANNELS OFFLINE  

JD DANNELS

    Tractorholic

  • Senior Member
  • Member No: 2011
  • 3,786 Thanks
  • 3,907 posts
  • Location: Newton.Ia

Posted November 23, 2012 - 08:25 PM

One more thing, I have seen people mix gasoline in diesel to prevent gelling.
I DO NOT RECCOMEND THIS IF THE MIX IS WRON IT CAN BLOW THE BEAD OFF.
When i worked the fuel island in the truck stop, we were forbidden to mix gasoline regardless of a drivers insistance as the truck stop could be liable if we did.

#13 Oo-v-oO OFFLINE  

Oo-v-oO

    New Member

  • Senior Member
  • Contributor
  • Member No: 5162
  • 340 Thanks
  • 448 posts
  • Location: Live Free or Die, USA

Posted November 23, 2012 - 09:54 PM

Not that I disagree with you, but the older VW diesel owner's manuals state that in cold weather it is permissible to mix several gallons of regular gasoline with a tank of diesel.

There are FAR better methods available now, and I wouldn't recommend it, but in an emergency a small amount of gas - and I stress SMALL - would be OK to use on an older diesel. I would couple that with some 2-stroke oil if I had to do it, and all bets are off on a newer, high pressure system.

#14 JD DANNELS OFFLINE  

JD DANNELS

    Tractorholic

  • Senior Member
  • Member No: 2011
  • 3,786 Thanks
  • 3,907 posts
  • Location: Newton.Ia

Posted November 23, 2012 - 10:07 PM

I agree that it can be done, it seems to me the VW held between 10 &12 gallons.
My tractor holds 5.5 gal. And back when I worked in the truck stop the trucks were running around 75-120 gal.
Im not reccomending it because when your working with a small total volume of fuel the percentage of gasoline goes up astronomically with very little added.




Top