13 replies to this topic

[boyscout862]

I was inspired by the work I've seen others accomplish on this site. After two years in the garage, I finished disassembly and cleaning my son's BIG TEN engine on Sunday. The gas tank, flywheel cover and backing plate were rotted through. I have a blown 23D that I am using for parts. I started assemblig it last night. I found that both magnetos are very rusted and I can't get any spark out of either of them. I had heard several years ago that one of the modern electronic magnetos will work and you then do away with the leaky points. Does anyone have suggestions.

By the way, future projects include: 2 B10s, Broadmower, Garden Squire, 3012 and an T816.

Edited by boyscout862, October 08, 2012 - 08:06 AM.

[Kurtee]

Take a look here, it might help you.

http://www.briggsand...g the ignition/

[achomesteader]

The Big Ten came with a model 243431 engine. Has it been changed to a model 23D?

Both, the 243431 and the 23D can operate with their original coil/armature and you can eliminate the points and condenser by using an electronic transistorized ignition module. See the links below.

http://www.amazon.co...ils_o02_s00_i00

http://www.ebay.com/...984.m1438.l2649

The Briggs Magnetron coil/armature (or equivalent) cannot be used on the 23D, but can be used successfully on the 243431 if you have the flywheel re-polarized.

Engines with flywheels that are not magnetron ready and have had a magnetron armature installed on them, sometimes won't start or are hard starting, and if they do start, will never run like they should.

If you want/need to have your flywheel re-polarized, Briggs will do it for free. Just be sure to pack it well to insulate it from damage. Include a short note describing what you need, the Model, Type and Code of the engine, and a return address.

Ship to:

Briggs & Stratton

Menomonee Falls Distribution Center

INBOUND DOCKS 1-13

N83W12529 OLD ORCHARD ROAD

MENOMONEE FALLS WISCONSIN 53051

[boyscout862]

Thankyou both I will look into these. I have one of those electronic kits, so I will try it. The engine is a 23D but the tractor had a restoration 20 years ago. Who knows what was done. Both my B10s, a generator, and a Magnatrac have 23Ds also, so, I need to figure this out.

[boyscout862]

Update: I couldn't find the transistorized module. I took all the components and cleaned the contact areas. Then tested all circuits with an ohm meter. I reassembled the ignition system and turned the flywheel by hand. When I turn it fast (100rpm), I get a nice blue spark in the tester with an 1/8" gap. If I turn it slow, no spark. I'm going to put the rest of the engine together and in the tractor.

I still want to find a good permanent repair. Does anybody make a replacement magneto? Can it be changed to a coil system like a Kohler?

Thanks to Kurtee and AChomesteader for your help.

[achomesteader]

There is no replacement for the 3-leg armature that's on your 23D, as far as I know. You do have some options, though.

You can try to find a flywheel and armature mount from an old, pre Magnetron era, 243431 and put them on your 23D. Then you can use a 2-leg armature, which is still available. It can be used with points or with the electronic transistorized ignition module that I posted the links for earlier. You could also have the 243431 flywheel re-polarized and use the Magnetron style armature and eliminate the points.

You could get a flywheel and armature mount from a later 243431 (after code date 81073100) and install on your 23D. Then you can use the Magnetron style armature. This flywheel would be Magnetron ready and does not have to be re-polarized.

You could also just change over to battery ignition, but you'll still have to use your points.



Here's an article on changing to battery ignition:

http://www.simpletra...eto_to_coil.htm

[boyscout862]

Thank you AChomesteader. This 23D has a two leg magneto. The parts engine was two leg also. The Magnatrac 23D(it may say B) is three legged and has a very different flywheel. I'm going to get this BIG TEN tractor together for now to be ready for snow. It has been a back burner project for two years. Last week I picked up two Curtis cabs. I believe one will fit it. The other will go on my Bolens 1050 when I get it going.

Will a flywheel from a much newer engine fit? I have a couple of dozen parts tractors from the 80s and 90s. When they were free, they were for me. Thanks for your help.

[achomesteader]

I don't know what to say about your engines. I've never seen an original 23D that didn't use a 3-leg armature. The 23D Series Illustrated Parts List shows a #296834 armature and no other. That's a 3-leg armature. Other 23 series engines used the Magna-Matic system ignition with the armature/coil under/behind the flywheel. As far as I know, the model 243400 series engines were the first Briggs cast iron engines to use the 2-leg armature.

Here's a link to the 23D IPL that I uploaded to the manuals section:

http://gardentractor...-model-23d-ipl/

I'm pretty sure some of the flywheels (Briggs #298975 and #395250) from other series of the cast iron engines can be used on the 23D. Also, the flywheels (#395250) that are Magnetron ready should have two red stripes around them.

[boyscout862]

Thank you again AChomesteader. The parts diagram has helped with another problem. As far as the 2 leg magnetos are concerned it I'm not really knowledgable. I sense that you are very knowledgable about these engines. I will inventory the engines in the basement by serial number and magneto just for the curiosity of it. There are 4 of the 23Ds and a 23A? I think. I'll let you know the resuslts. I'll also try to find the serial numbers of the tractors. I have the manual which will show where to look.

Are you looking for anything in particular for your toys?

[achomesteader]

Are you looking for anything in particular for your toys?

Right now, all I'm looking for is a grille for an A-C, model no. 1600119, early Homesteader 8hp tractor. Hope you find one of those in your basement.

[boyscout862]

Thanks again. I don't know the tractor but a picture and description will help me keep an eye out. I went to a big tractor swap meet last Saturday and just missed a 42" plow for the Big Ten. It still had original paint and decals for $50. I'm going to another meet this Saturday and will keep it in mind. Is this what the tractor looks like? http://newlondon.cra...3323996649.html This looks alot like my Broadmoor.

I just looked at the two engines that have the two legged magnetos. The yellow one has no decal nor model and serial numbers visible because of rot of the flywheel housing.The plate next to the clyinder is blank. The black one has the decal but there are no numbers. Maybe the sheet metal pieces have been replaced before. The Big Ten is Serial number044001.

Edited by boyscout862, October 10, 2012 - 10:35 AM.

[achomesteader]

Yes, this is an early Homesteader 8hp:



The grille is accordion style, and can be found on A-C B-207s, some B-208s and the early model Homesteader 8. Here's a link to a pic of a B-208 that shows the style grille that I need:

http://i.ebayimg.com...hK7g~~60_57.JPG

About the engines:
The 23D would have originally had the model numbers stamped into a plate fastened to the cylinder shield. The cylinder bore is 3". The flywheel is larger in diameter on the front (finned side) than on the back (magnet side). The flywheel key (#24 in drawing below) is held in place on the front of the flywheel with a screw. The armature mount should look like #588 in the drawing. Should have a 3-leg armature.



The model series 243400 engines were 3 1/16" bore. The flywheel is a single diameter. The armature mount is like #588 in the next drawing. The armature is 2-leg.



The early model 243431 engine should have the model numbers stamped into the blower housing on the carb side, at about the level of the crankshaft. You can see in the pic of my Big Ten below, where I scratched the paint off the blower housing to be able to read the numbers. Sometimes they're hard to find because they're filled in with the paint.



My Big Ten is serial no. 041793, so mine is just a bit older.

Hope this helps with your engine identification and hope you find a plow also.

Edited by achomesteader, October 10, 2012 - 06:05 PM.

[boyscout862]

Thank you. Your picture was worth more than a thousand words. The yellow and black engines are 243000 series. I was unable to find their numbers before and used an incorrect identification idea. The white one is a 23D. I can't get at the generators nor the other B10 for now.

Your BIG TEN looks just like mine. Now that it will probably be running by the end of the weekend my son is interested in it again. He can vacuum the leaves.

What are the dimensions of your grill? I assume that you want it in near perfect condition. It looks identical to the one on my JD210. I will sketch it in my notebook and look for it. I just found out that there is another swap meet on Sunday so it will be an interesting weekend.

Thankyou very much for the education. I hope that I can repay you.

[achomesteader]

The grille is about 10" wide X 9 3/8" high. Near perfect condition will do just fine.

Thanks.

Edited by achomesteader, October 10, 2012 - 08:36 PM.