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#16 thirdroc17 OFFLINE  

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Posted November 20, 2012 - 11:19 AM

Nope, don't buy it. I've used a lot of K&N's over the years and have had nothing but resounding success with them. Their wide spread use among the performance industry can't be just a fluke. They use them because they work. As for the "official test", it looked to me like a guy cobbling stuff together under uncontrolled circumstances. Any results would be flawed or easily skewed. In his disclaimer he admitted to "leaving the results up to nature".

I'll keep using what has proven positive results over time and variable circumstances.
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#17 LilysDad ONLINE  

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Posted November 21, 2012 - 08:37 AM

Yeah, a real test would involve flow meters and mass spectrometers. :thumbs:

#18 HydroHarold OFFLINE  

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Posted November 21, 2012 - 11:14 PM

Correct me if I'm wrong (And I have every expectation you will!:D) But "performance" filters are just for better performance or higher engine output for competition or service in racing conditions or on engines that are serviced VERY often. How could an air filter which has less restriction (larger "holes") be of any use at all on an industrial/tractor engine in the usual dirty tractor applications?

A truck going down a dusty road gets way less dirt up by the "less restricted" air intake (unless you follow other trucks down that dusty road) than almost all tractor engines in use. I wouldn't need any fancy tests when common sense gives me the answer. I don't understand.... yet.

#19 marlboro180 OFFLINE  

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Posted November 21, 2012 - 11:21 PM

I am standing out in that confused field as well HH... :ah_shoot:

#20 LilysDad ONLINE  

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Posted November 22, 2012 - 07:39 AM

How could an air filter which has less restriction (larger "holes") be of any use at all on an industrial/tractor engine in the usual dirty tractor applications?


How about more little holes?

I replaced the air cleaner on a K301 with the aircleaner from a K341, which is the same dia. but is taller.

#21 thirdroc17 OFFLINE  

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Posted November 25, 2012 - 03:27 PM

The K&N doesn't have "larger" holes, they have greater surface area via their design. There may not be as much to be gained with a stock replacement filter, but when you install a larger filter, with much greater surface area, you can have greater flow through much smaller holes because there are so many of them. Plus, K&N, and many others like them, don't rely on just a small hole, they are also oiled making them sticky.

#22 DougT ONLINE  

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Posted November 26, 2012 - 10:19 AM

Plus, K&N, and many others like them, don't rely on just a small hole, they are also oiled making them sticky.


Ah Yes!! The old K&N oil. That stuff does wonders to the mass airflow sensors in the modern automobiles. Everytime I get a vehicle through the door with poor performance and it has a K&N I feel like telling them to get it back to stock and then I'll work on it. On the ATIS tractor list there was a guy that worked n a quarry-excavation type setting. The management looked at how much they were spending on OEM air filters for the big equipment and switched to K&N to save. At every oil change the oil was sent off for analysis. By the second oil change there was more dirt and metal particles showing up in the oil. They ditched the K&N's and went back to OEM and the oil readings turned around.

#23 thirdroc17 OFFLINE  

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Posted November 27, 2012 - 02:17 AM

If you want to start mud slinging, I can always come back with I have 140,000 miles on my Ranger with it's PROPERLY OILED air cleaner, and never a problem. Still doesn't burn a lick of oil.

If it didn't work for you, fine, but they have served me well for 30 years.

#24 LilysDad ONLINE  

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Posted November 27, 2012 - 08:23 AM

How about those old time oil bath filters? The ones where the air makes a sharp 180 and slings the dirt into a lake of oil. Are we sure it all gets trapped?

#25 Cvans ONLINE  

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Posted November 27, 2012 - 10:44 AM

I'm not going to get into the "good and bad K&N filter thing" but I do believe each type of filter has it's place. As per the Ford truck forums I made a couple of changes on the intake ducting on our 97 F-150. One was enlarging the opening on the intake snorkel and the other was switching to a K&N. The difference was amazing. The truck feels like it has 20 more hp. and I gained about 2 mpg. Do I run K&N on my other vehicles? No.
Generally speaking the larger the paper filter (more pleats) the better the air flow is going to be. This depends somewhat on the filter media also. I for one have a lot of faith in the old oil bath filters. There are a lot of old farm tractors out there that are over 50 years old and are still doing a good days work that are equipped with these filters. These tractors are operating in some of the worst conditions possible and have long out lived their original owners. If properly maintained they seem to be very effective and self cleaning with clean oil.

#26 HydroHarold OFFLINE  

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Posted November 28, 2012 - 12:28 AM

"More LITTLE holes." Which is EXACTLY why construction machinery filters are so BIG. You need more little holes (filter media surface area) to continue filtering longer in dirty/high volume air use conditions. I remember oil bath aircleaners well, from one cylinder to straight eights and V12 flatheads and I can tell you one thing, oil baths did filter, but I don't think they would remove the micron size dust a new closer machined higher revving modern engine would require. Imagine in the "old days" expecting to see your hulking straight eight going 200,000+miles without a tear down. It just didn't happen back then. New lubricants and new metalurgy and close tolerances require way cleaner air for peak performance and the expected long life,IMNSHO.

I addition, "YOUR" engine isn't "MY" engine so please feel my blessings towards finding that different filtering road to follow, but I'm going OEM specs all the way even if I have to pay that JD dealer "premium $". :wave:

#27 thirdroc17 OFFLINE  

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Posted November 28, 2012 - 06:48 PM

Doug, I apologize for posting emotionally instead of rationally. Like my boss keeps putting in my yearly evaluation, "Needs to work on his people skills."

That said, I still like my K&N's. :D But everyone should be, and is welcome to their opinion. :peace:
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#28 Cvans ONLINE  

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Posted November 28, 2012 - 09:07 PM

"Needs to work on his people skills."

If that dosen't work try a different boss. :D
Seriously, good people skills are a big asset and it sounds like your boss is a pretty good guy. That's the nice thing about this forum is being able to express your choice in these matters without being blasted for your opinion. I'll still take an oil bath filter on farm equipment over buying those expensive paper filters. :smilewink:
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#29 DougT ONLINE  

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Posted November 29, 2012 - 08:24 AM

Doug, I apologize for posting emotionally instead of rationally. Like my boss keeps putting in my yearly evaluation, "Needs to work on his people skills."

That said, I still like my K&N's. :D But everyone should be, and is welcome to their opinion. :peace:


No apology necessary, Dale. Think of it like Fox news, I report-you decide. Like they say, "Your mileage may vary" When I need extra air I turn the lid over on my V-8. A little oil residue on the airflow sensor of a Ranger might richen it up enough to hide the inherent leaks from their plastic intake, but that's another rant. I can't complain too loud, they make me money!

PS: They've been missing you over on Paul's group.

#30 thirdroc17 OFFLINE  

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Posted December 31, 2012 - 03:44 PM

:wave:  I don't like Fox News either, :rolling: But then, I don't trust any of the network news anymore, 'nough said on THAT!

 

I'm missing on several forums from time to time, as evidence by the gap with this post.  Oh well.

 

Yes, Ron is, well now was, a great boss.  (I'm no longer working there)  He treated his people like people.  He can give one heck of a butt chewing when needed, but he didn't withhold praise either.






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