Jump to content

Vote for Featured Tractor of the Month!
Garden Tractors and Parts on eBay



Photo
- - - - -

What Small Engine Is Easiest To Modify For Performance?


  • Please log in to reply
27 replies to this topic

#16 wvbuzzmaster OFFLINE  

wvbuzzmaster

    Squeaky Wheel

  • Senior Member
  • -GTt Supporter-
  • Contributor
  • Member No: 1792
  • 4,662 Thanks
  • 7,409 posts
  • Location: West Virginia

Posted September 09, 2012 - 11:23 AM

The Kohlers are built strong and are easy to rebuild and work on. The 12,14 and 16 share the same block and it seems to me that the 12's seem to hold up better perhaps because they do not produce as much heat and have more metal left in the block.


Brian, I hate to bust your bubble, but the 12 Hp K301 is not the same block as a 14 Hp K341, the head bolt pattern is a dead giveaway. Also, the 12 Hp K301 shares the same block as the 10 Hp K241. I have never owned a 16 Hp Kohler, so I am not even going to try to guess there. Just wanted to clear up Kohler confusion.

#17 Amigatec OFFLINE  

Amigatec

    Collector of Rusty Junk

  • Senior Member
  • -GTt Supporter-
  • Contributor
  • Member No: 5899
  • 2,025 Thanks
  • 3,172 posts
  • Location: Haskell Oklahoma

Posted September 09, 2012 - 11:35 AM

In fact there are a few 10 hp K blocks that are really 12 hp block, just bored smaller.

Also I believe the 14 hp blocks the cylinder is bored off center, so it has a slight offset.

#18 boostedbuick OFFLINE  

boostedbuick
  • Member
  • Contributor
  • Member No: 9210
  • 73 Thanks
  • 84 posts
  • Location: Northeast Kansas

Posted September 09, 2012 - 02:48 PM

I love it when a decision is made for me. 2 phone calls netted me a very likely engine swap candidate:

A kubota Z430 12 hp twin cylinder water cooled diesel!

Went and looked at it today, OF COURSE I GOT PICS!

Anyway the whole tractor is there (well most of it anyway). Kubota G4200 if you want to google it. Small engine tinkerer has it. Says it runs but it doesn't run quite right and he doesn't know much about them. Says $100 will own it, so I pretty much already bought it. Tape measure eyeball method says it'll fit, IF I cut about a 4X6 hole in the belly pan for the oil pan to protrude. Modifying that area of the dozer (where it will never be seen) doesn't bug me too much. Radiator will fit the grillle opening but the mechanical fan will have to go if I am to turn it sideways. Lil electric fan might have to do, with a switch to keep the current drain to a minimum.

102_1548 sized.jpg 102_1552 sized.jpg
  • wvbuzzmaster said thank you

#19 LilysDad ONLINE  

LilysDad

    --Crazy about GTTalk-- 'sort of'

  • Senior Member
  • Contributor
  • Member No: 10443
  • 11,413 Thanks
  • 8,669 posts
  • Location: N. Illinois, DeKalb County

Posted September 09, 2012 - 03:13 PM

the 12 Hp K301 is not the same block as a 14 Hp K341, the head bolt pattern is a dead giveaway.

Also I believe the 14 hp blocks the cylinder is bored off center, so it has a slight offset.


A lot of misinformation here. The 14 hp is the K321. The K341 is the 16 horse and the K341 has the offset bore and extra head bolt.
The K241, 301, and 321 all have the same block.
  • bowtiebutler956 said thank you

#20 Cvans ONLINE  

Cvans

    Tractorholic

  • Senior Member
  • -GTt Supporter-
  • Member No: 5412
  • 5,536 Thanks
  • 5,606 posts
  • Location: Eastern SD.

Posted September 09, 2012 - 03:14 PM

Trust me when I say you don't want the oil pan hanging out underneath a crawler. There will be very little ground clearance as it is and the pan will make a lousy skid plate. If you need clearance your much better off adding a scoop to the hood.

#21 boostedbuick OFFLINE  

boostedbuick
  • Member
  • Contributor
  • Member No: 9210
  • 73 Thanks
  • 84 posts
  • Location: Northeast Kansas

Posted September 09, 2012 - 03:53 PM

It's funny you should mention that. The oil pan will stick down about 2 inches under the engine mount pad, but that part of the dozer floor actually sits up a bit from the rest of the bottom. Hard to describe, but it's not going to be the lowest point on the crawler. A good skid plate is probably still a good idea though.

#22 JDBrian OFFLINE  

JDBrian

    Super Moderator

  • Super Moderator
  • Staff
  • -GTt Supporter-
  • Contributor
  • Member No: 2507
  • 9,595 Thanks
  • 14,140 posts
  • Location: Hubley, Nova Scotia - Canada

Posted September 09, 2012 - 03:58 PM

Brian, I hate to bust your bubble, but the 12 Hp K301 is not the same block as a 14 Hp K341, the head bolt pattern is a dead giveaway. Also, the 12 Hp K301 shares the same block as the 10 Hp K241. I have never owned a 16 Hp Kohler, so I am not even going to try to guess there. Just wanted to clear up Kohler confusion.


Casey, I think all 3 use the same basic hunk of iron for the block and each may have it's own special features. The point I was trying to make was that the lower HP engines put less thermal stress on the block because there is less heat input and a bit more mass to soak up the heat. It just seems like a lot of the 14's are turning up with cracked blocks.
  • wvbuzzmaster said thank you

#23 wvbuzzmaster OFFLINE  

wvbuzzmaster

    Squeaky Wheel

  • Senior Member
  • -GTt Supporter-
  • Contributor
  • Member No: 1792
  • 4,662 Thanks
  • 7,409 posts
  • Location: West Virginia

Posted September 09, 2012 - 04:05 PM

Casey, I think all 3 use the same basic hunk of iron for the block and each may have it's own special features. The point I was trying to make was that the lower HP engines put less thermal stress on the block because there is less heat input and a bit more mass to soak up the heat. It just seems like a lot of the 14's are turning up with cracked blocks.


The 14 HP Kohler that was on the 444 had a cracked head problem after I sold it. I never plan to own another 14 HP Kohler, no more than a 12 HP for me.

#24 JDBrian OFFLINE  

JDBrian

    Super Moderator

  • Super Moderator
  • Staff
  • -GTt Supporter-
  • Contributor
  • Member No: 2507
  • 9,595 Thanks
  • 14,140 posts
  • Location: Hubley, Nova Scotia - Canada

Posted September 09, 2012 - 04:15 PM

In this area there are at least 3 people looking for K321's on Kijiji. 2 for a JD314 and one for an Ariens GT. I know that on my tractor the PO let the engine get so plugged up with grass that it must have been running very hot. I think this seals the fate of a lot of these engines. They also tend to carbon up around the exhaust valve and that doesn't help matters when it gets to extreme amounts. The carbon was eating into the top of the piston on mine. They will run a lot of hours if properly cared for. Someone locally s trying to sell a twin cylinder Kohler from a sawmill with 6600 hours on it. They have replaced the engine but say the old one still runs although it burns a lot of oil. I thought only a diesel could run that many hours.

#25 wvbuzzmaster OFFLINE  

wvbuzzmaster

    Squeaky Wheel

  • Senior Member
  • -GTt Supporter-
  • Contributor
  • Member No: 1792
  • 4,662 Thanks
  • 7,409 posts
  • Location: West Virginia

Posted September 09, 2012 - 05:02 PM

Well, I know when I get to the 14 HP Kohler I can't hardly get the right model number, I mean I called it a 341, not 321.... I dunno, I just know to pull the head, clean the carbon, make sure shrouds are clean, and I run Gumout in all my tractors whether they need it or not. That Gumout does wonders for the ability to idle any engine down.

#26 Cvans ONLINE  

Cvans

    Tractorholic

  • Senior Member
  • -GTt Supporter-
  • Member No: 5412
  • 5,536 Thanks
  • 5,606 posts
  • Location: Eastern SD.

Posted September 09, 2012 - 06:19 PM

Hard to describe, but it's not going to be the lowest point on the crawler.

That's good to hear. Sorry I misunderstood you.
  • boostedbuick said thank you

#27 LilysDad ONLINE  

LilysDad

    --Crazy about GTTalk-- 'sort of'

  • Senior Member
  • Contributor
  • Member No: 10443
  • 11,413 Thanks
  • 8,669 posts
  • Location: N. Illinois, DeKalb County

Posted September 09, 2012 - 06:54 PM

For information on the Kohler K series modifications and specifications, it's hard to beat Brian Miller's tractor pulling web site. It's been around for awhile and probably isn't state of the art, but it should be a must read for folks wanting to mess with a Kohler.
  • boostedbuick said thank you

#28 boostedbuick OFFLINE  

boostedbuick
  • Member
  • Contributor
  • Member No: 9210
  • 73 Thanks
  • 84 posts
  • Location: Northeast Kansas

Posted September 09, 2012 - 07:17 PM

Yeah I spent about 3 minutes on that site before I bookmarked it for future reference. :)




Top