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Update -Oil Leak On K321- Bad News?


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#31 JDBrian OFFLINE  

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Posted May 22, 2012 - 03:53 PM

You said you

Think it was just some left on sludge that is worked loose by the heat of running it? It's a nice thought at least.


Chuck, the stuff that's been coming out is definitely fresh. I just ran it for about 35minutes doing some box blading and I can see a couple of drops in the area where I first noticed the oil. I don't think I'll get out tonight to take it apart again.

When my cylinder cracked, I couldn't see it just looking down into the bore. But I could feel it with my fingernail, so then I just found some good black sludge, put some on my finger & wiped across the area. Then when I wiped the bore with a dry rag, the black line showed right up.


Daniel that reminds me that I could see a line in the bore that I thought was a scuff mark from the carbon buildup. Maybe that was a crack. I'll see if I can find a picture. Found one where I had just taken the head off. You can see the lines in the bore just between the valves. That would put the leak on the right side of the cylinder when looking at the front of the engine which was one of the areas that was wet.

DSCF5889.jpg

#32 tinner OFFLINE  

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Posted May 22, 2012 - 04:07 PM

Blew an engine in a company truck just outside Forest Mississippi back in 1970. When the Chey house was putting it back together I went by and looked at it and noticed a crack in one cylinder wall. Said something to the mechanic and he said it was oil running down the wall. I told him you can't catch your fingernail on an oil run. After looking at it again they ordered a new shot block for Jackson so I had to spend another three days in the hotel.
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#33 olcowhand ONLINE  

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Posted May 22, 2012 - 04:36 PM

Brian, it's impossible to tell from the reflections off the cylinder wall, but it's likely it is cracked. Hope not, but signs are all pointing to it.

#34 JDBrian OFFLINE  

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Posted May 22, 2012 - 06:57 PM

Ok guys. Postmortem pictures are in. The first 2 are after cleaning it. The last 4 are after reassembly and running for a half hour. The last 2 pics are of the flywheel to make sure the oil wasn't coming up from a leaking seal and peaking in through the snorkel hole in the shroud to see that the oil extends back to the rear corner of the cylinder. Looks pretty conclusive and also looks like it is in the general area of those lines on the bore. It's hard to see but the cylinder is wetter further back. It must have been cooked real good at some point!

Before running
DSCF7677.jpg DSCF7680.jpg


After running 1/2 hr.
DSCF7681.jpg DSCF7683.jpg

DSCF7686.jpg DSCF7688.jpg

#35 chris m ONLINE  

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Posted May 22, 2012 - 07:03 PM

Well we all hoped for a simple fix for you. Sorry to see that it is cracked :(

Will you just use as is? Or are you going to get it sleeved?

#36 JDBrian OFFLINE  

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Posted May 22, 2012 - 07:17 PM

Well I think for now it'll get used as is. I really don't need it for any heavy work because i have a 2320 compact tractor. It is mostly for my wife to use with a cart and I have a box blade for grading my trails once in a while but no PTO work at all, no mowing etc. I'm going to keep my eye out for a re power option. If it was just a matter of re sleeving it then it wouldn't be so bad but if you look at the picture of the cylinder and piston the piston is worn away on the top due to the carbon that was built up and also I'm thinking the whole motor has a lot of hours. I'd be looking at a lot more work. The carb needs a throttle bushing as well. I'm leaning towards another engine entirely. Mostly they repower these with Vanguard twins. I really would rather stay with a single of similar HP. It's time to do some research on what will work. A 10hp diesel would be something I'd consider as well. I'm not really surprised as it was in bad shape when I bought it. The funny thing is that it starts and runs pretty well even with the crack. Tough engines!

#37 Alc ONLINE  

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Posted May 23, 2012 - 05:51 AM

Sorry to hear that it turned out to be a crack . Sounds like your going to just use " as-is" until you get a replacement engine . At least you know at some point it needs to be taken care of , guessing when you get tired of cleaning up oil . I've have soooo many quick-fixes / temp. repairs , that I could name that lasted a very long time and I bet my wife would add some that I forgot , Al

#38 KennyP ONLINE  

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Posted May 23, 2012 - 05:59 AM

Sorry it wasn't a simple fix! I hope you can find a decent replacement for it.

#39 JDBrian OFFLINE  

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Posted May 23, 2012 - 04:07 PM

JB Weld then emery cloth? I know that sounds like a bandaid, but what do you have to lose! :)


Is this suggestion likely to work at all? When I think of what is going on here it seems as if the oil film on the cylinder wall is being forced out by the combustion pressure during the power stroke and to some extent on the compression stroke as well. I'm not sure JBWeld is up to that kind of pressure. I'm willing to give it a try but if it has no chance of working then I'd be wasting my time. If it will slow the oil leakage for a bit then I'd try it.

#40 MH81 OFFLINE  

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Posted May 23, 2012 - 04:13 PM

My uncle repaired valve seats in a JD60 with JB Weld many years ago. Tractor still running.

You'll need enough area to fill (enlarge it ??? gasp) and zero oil in the crack.

I would do as you posted above and run it. You will probably get many miles out of it before the problem gets worse. Until then, keep your eye open for a good block with a bad head or damaged something else...

#41 bgkid2966 ONLINE  

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Posted May 23, 2012 - 04:54 PM

I would still hook up the air hose to it and spray soapy water to get an exact location for the leak. You may be able to JB Weld it and slow the leak considerably or stop it, albeit temporarily. Worth at try in my humble opinion.

Geno

#42 JDBrian OFFLINE  

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Posted May 23, 2012 - 07:14 PM

I know roughly where the leak is. It's on the cylinder portion of the block which is separated from the valve section by a narrow passageway for airflow. Down this narrow passage is where the leak is. My chances of getting that clean and oil free are pretty slim. My gut feeling is that JB weld won't hold on something like this. I think I'll run it like it is for a while and look for an unmolested K321 or 341 and also repower options. Thanks for the help guys.

#43 Amigatec OFFLINE  

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Posted May 23, 2012 - 07:45 PM

I looked at using JBWeld for sealing the exhaust on a B&S and read that it's not for areas with a lot of heat.
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#44 JDBrian OFFLINE  

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Posted May 24, 2012 - 05:03 AM

The leak is in the wost possible spot for getting it sealed and the presence of oil soaked into the area would make it nearly impossible to clean it to the point where you could get a good bond. Then there is the heat as you've noted and pressure. A tough job for any adhesive.

#45 KennyP ONLINE  

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Posted May 24, 2012 - 05:48 AM

About the only way I see to fix it would possibly be a sleeve, but that may make the crack worse. Sounds like another block is the best way.




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