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The Differance Between A Dealer Model And Chainstore Model


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#16 EricFromPa OFFLINE  

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Posted November 30, 2012 - 09:02 AM

Personally I'm sick of rebuilding worn out K series Kohlers.Every one that I've had to rebuild or replace has had the snott beat out of them and well over 2K hours on the engines though.
After redoing a few dozen,you see a pattern and common flaw in them.The short stroke causes the bore to egg out on every single one of them.
The big old cast iron Briggs engines and bigger Tecumseh engines I've had never egged out.They may of had Carb troubles or bad rings or ignition troubles or bad valve seats and guides but that's all.

You can't kill the older 1960-80s CC or JD or Sears trans-axles unless you really really abuse them.
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#17 bgkid2966 OFFLINE  

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Posted November 30, 2012 - 09:09 AM

I can not even imagine how many hours are on my k301. It is probably egg shaped like the rest of them. I rebuilt it about ten years ago and work it extremely hard in the winter. It smokes a little now and I am OK with that. I will rebuild it again and bore it when the time comes. No repower for me.



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#18 boyscout862 OFFLINE  

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Posted November 30, 2012 - 03:14 PM

Personally I'm sick of rebuilding worn out K series Kohlers.Every one that I've had to rebuild or replace has had the snott beat out of them and well over 2K hours on the engines though.
After redoing a few dozen,you see a pattern and common flaw in them.The short stroke causes the bore to egg out on every single one of them.
The big old cast iron Briggs engines and bigger Tecumseh engines I've had never egged out.They may of had Carb troubles or bad rings or ignition troubles or bad valve seats and guides but that's all.

You can't kill the older 1960-80s CC or JD or Sears trans-axles unless you really really abuse them.


I thought that 2k hours was pretty good for a small engine to last. It takes my old sunnen hone about 1 to 1.5 hours to take the cylinder to 0.010 over, with it round enough. The problem I have is the crank, I don't trust any of the shops around here. I plan to rebuild 4 this winter.

Edited by boyscout862, November 30, 2012 - 03:16 PM.


#19 EricFromPa OFFLINE  

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Posted November 30, 2012 - 06:30 PM

My old 1966 briggs has never had any machine work done to it other than a very slight hone to break in new rings.It's had 1 set of new rings and a gasket kit put in it over 20 years ago.I forget what year it was exactly.Kohlers are good engines for what they are.If they would of gave them 1 more inch of stroke on the top end and Bearing insert for the con rod they would last atleast 50% longer.

#20 CubHorse80 OFFLINE  

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Posted January 09, 2013 - 05:17 PM

Basically, big box store models are MTD and dealer models are real. allthough now a day, they are all mtd but the dealer models are made in USA and big box in china



#21 HDWildBill OFFLINE  

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Posted January 09, 2013 - 05:42 PM

Having worked on box store, large and small dealer tractors the big difference I see between the two is how they are set up.  Tractor's that come from the dealer's have lubrication where they are supposed to and are set up according to spec's  the box store on the other hand are thrown together, things not adjusted right and very seldom have lubrication where it is supposed to so premature failure occurs. 


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#22 scotsman OFFLINE  

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Posted January 30, 2013 - 08:54 PM

I have done some research on this topic..

I compared "dealer models" to "big box models", what I discovered is this:

(the quote below is from my snowblower webpage, so its talking about snowblowers..

but replace the word "snowblower" with the word "tractor" and I bet everything will still apply! ;)

 

This leads me to an interesting snowblower myth I came across constantly in my research,
the myth goes something like this: "The snowblower manufacturers make lower-quality machines for the Lowes/ Home Depot/ Walmart market, they arent the same machines that you will find at an independant dealer."

 

I have discovered this is simply not true.

 

The EXACT same machines are being sold at my local Home Depot and Lowes stores and all the independant dealers..

I checked model numbers.. all the independant dealers have the exact same machines as the big-boxes, and I found no models that were only at Home Depot or Lowes, and not at the independant dealers.

 

There is no such thing as a lower quality machine FOR the big-box market specifically.

 

But like all good myths, there is probably a grain of truth in there somewhere!
I believe what might have happened is this..

Perhaps lower-grade machines are now being built, because of the big-box market! 

Because sadly, these days Americans dont really care about quality anymore. All we care about is price. "I dont care if its junk, as long as its cheap!" We are getting our wish..we buy an awful lot of cheap junk. This attitude has led to the great success of Walmart, and the loss of all our jobs. (you cant make junk cheap enough for Americans to buy it, if you have to pay Americans to build it...thats why the jobs go to China, because we demand to pay less and less for it all the time..at Walmart.) by the time we, as a society, finally "wake up" it will be too late..everything will be made in China. You will still be able to buy it all at Walmart, but you wont have a job to pay for it.
 

But anyway..I digress.
yes, this all does relate to snowblowers!

Getting back to them...Yes, its true you will find the "low end" machines at the big boxes,
(and the big-boxes carry the mid and higher levels too)
but! in my travels around Western NY, all the dealers carry the same low-end models as
the big boxes! they probably arent happy about it, but they have to carry them just to survive..
If you are a dealer, and Home Depot is selling machines for $599, and all yours start at $800..well, anyone can see thats not a healthy business practice.

 

Yes, I suppose there might be some independant dealers out there who can, with all honesty and truthfullness, say "Home Depot and Lowes carry the cheaper machines, I dont have those cheap models in my store".

If that is true, its only due to that dealers personal choice.
and if there are any dealers making that choice, I bet they are few...
I havent seen any.

 

That is the only scenerio where anyone could truthfully say "The snowblower manufacturers make lower-quality machines for the Lowes/ Home Depot/ Walmart market, but I dont carry those models here."

 

So in a general sense, its a total myth. there are not different models made for the Big-box market. they are all the same models. However I believe its quite likely that newer, lower-end models have been created because of the big-box market! (because people must have their cheap junk).. to the detriment of the entire industry, and that is likely what led to this myth..but thats really a different scenerio.

Having said all that, I agree with the many who say its always much better to buy from the independant dealer! for two major reasons: 

 

1. Quality assembly by knowledgeable technicians. this is VERY important!
2. Service and support after the sale, also very important.

 

You get neither of those from the big-boxes.

I have read a lot about problems with newer, quality machines..almost always these machines were bought from a big-box..and were assembled by people who dont know what they are doing. I went to a lot of Big-box stores for knowledge, just to look at lots of different machines..but if I was going to buy a new one, I wouldnt buy one there.

 

 

I havent looked at tractors models specifically in the same way, but for tractor brands that sell at both dealers and the big boxes (like JD and Cub Cadet) im sure the same concepts apply..

Which means no, there are not "different models" for the big boxes specifically..if a dealer chooses to not sell the low-end "big box" models, they can choose to do that..but there is no specific segreation of models depending on where they are going to be sold..

but I suspect the "big box market" has resulted in cheaper, lower-end models of everthing, by all the manufacturers..

 

(Tractor Supply is actually a very low-end dealer IMO..they sell the junkiest "no-name" stuff from China, which is even a step-down from Lowes and Home depot..I put Tractor Supply in the same catagory as Walmart when it comes to tractors, mowers and snowblowers..)

 

Scot


Edited by scotsman, January 30, 2013 - 10:24 PM.
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